Help Our UAL Friends

"sfb" wrote in message news:luAXe.1713$Az1.376@trnddc07...
I suggest you lock up the Congress critters as UAL and the other legacy
carriers are only doing what the law permits. If they were ignoring the
law, the SEC would have done a number on them long ago for incorrect
financial reporting by a public company.

I think that the time has come and past, where companies can so easily dodge
a pension plan's obligations. There should be laws passed to protect all
pension plans, by holding them in trust, or whatever means are necessary.
Allowing them to dodge them is, IMHO, a breach of contract.

Who is going to pay for all of the people who lose their pension, as they
get aged, and were planing to live off it? You and I, the younger worker,
one way or the other.
--
Jim in NC

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

Who is going to pay for all of the people who lose their pension, as they
get aged, and were planing to live off it? You and I, the younger worker,
one way or the other.


Yes, because money will be taken from us unlawfully and given to them. So
what good are laws?

"Morgans" wrote in message I think that the time has come and past, where
companies can so easily dodge
a pension plan's obligations. There should be laws passed to protect all
pension plans, by holding them in trust, or whatever means are necessary.
Allowing them to dodge them is, IMHO, a breach of contract.

There ARE laws in place. And there are a few Congress critters who exercise
intelligence of a higher order. A couple of them wrote guidelines for
'defined contribution plans (401k)'. Most workers with defined benefit plans
scoffed at 401k plans, but 401Ks aren't looking so bad now. Which plan do
the profitable carriers offer?

D.

("sfb" wrote)
I suggest you lock up the Congress critters as UAL and the other legacy
carriers are only doing what the law permits. If they were ignoring the
law, the SEC would have done a number on them long ago for incorrect
financial reporting by a public company.


25% of this country's economic problems can be directly traced back to the
SEC and their inability to come up with clear accounting rules - and then
enforce them in any meaningful way. [Cite? Me]

Agreed on point A: Pensions should be off limits to Lee Iacocca CEO types.
Over funded
my ass -- for today maybe. How about in 12 years? Oops, a turn around in the
numbers? "Congress" (meaning you$$ you$$ you$$ and you$$) ..."help!!"


Montblack

"Montblack" wrote in message
...
("sfb" wrote)
I suggest you lock up the Congress critters as UAL and the other legacy
carriers are only doing what the law permits. If they were ignoring the
law, the SEC would have done a number on them long ago for incorrect
financial reporting by a public company.


25% of this country's economic problems can be directly traced back to the
SEC and their inability to come up with clear accounting rules - and then
enforce them in any meaningful way. [Cite? Me]

Agreed on point A: Pensions should be off limits to Lee Iacocca CEO types.
Over funded
my ass -- for today maybe. How about in 12 years? Oops, a turn around in
the
numbers? "Congress" (meaning you$$ you$$ you$$ and you$$) ..."help!!"


Montblack


The company has an obligation to provide benefits and has to fund the plan
to provide for those benefits. Overfunding belongs to the Company.

Mike
MU-2

"Carl Ellis" wrote in message
.. .

Closing the door after the cow leaves, but ...

The government needs to throw the *******s who underfunded the pension
plan
in prison. After that, no executive will consider letting a plan get in
that position.


- Carl -
Agreed, life in prison that would fix the problem. Throw the union leaders
in also. They are supposed to do something for their members.

Carl Ellis wrote:
Closing the door after the cow leaves, but ...

The government needs to throw the *******s who underfunded the pension plan
in prison. After that, no executive will consider letting a plan get in
that position.

Sounds like you are talking about the unions. The unions struck in
order to get this pension that UAL couldn't afford. However, you don't
know if it was underfunded BEFORE or AFTER the discount carriers ate
their lunch.

-Robert

Sounds like you are talking about the unions. The unions struck in
order to get this pension that UAL couldn't afford. However, you don't
know if it was underfunded BEFORE or AFTER the discount carriers ate
their lunch.


It's a pretty safe bet that it was underfunded well before. There not many
companies that fully fund the pensions - simply because they don't have to.

An intersting note is that company executives usually don't get personally
bit by the pension disasters. Their plans are often seperately and fully
funded.

By law a pension fund can't be underfunded. The problem is the actuarial
assumptions haven't been coming true especially the estimates on
investments of the pension fund.

The airlines are just the tip of the iceberg. There many local and state
government pension funds are also underfunded. You might be able to sell
some airplanes to fund the pensions, but who wants to buy a school?

"Carl Ellis" wrote in message
...

Sounds like you are talking about the unions. The unions struck in
order to get this pension that UAL couldn't afford. However, you
don't
know if it was underfunded BEFORE or AFTER the discount carriers ate
their lunch.


It's a pretty safe bet that it was underfunded well before. There not
many
companies that fully fund the pensions - simply because they don't
have to.

An intersting note is that company executives usually don't get
personally
bit by the pension disasters. Their plans are often seperately and
fully
funded.

I have some empathy for these people, but they are not high on my list
of deserving victims. It's interesting that people want the government
out of their lives until they need something; then it's a run for the
taxpayers handout. Let this group of people ask the unions to make up
their pensions, IMO.



Orval Fairbairn wrote:
A neighbor, who is UAL (ret) asked me to circulate this one.

They make some pretty good points, as the UAL people currently stand to
get reamed pretty badly.

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