Full deflection = missed approach ???

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

"Peter R." wrote in message
...

As you know, when first being vectored for the ILS, most times the
glideslope will be pegged.


What are you using for guidance when you're being vectored for the ILS?

The method of guidance was not a stated criterion in this thread.

--
Peter
























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"Peter R." wrote in message
...

The method of guidance was not a stated criterion in this thread.


Did it have to be? Full deflection of the localizer or glideslope is rather
meaningless when neither is being used for guidance.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
hlink.net...

"Peter R." wrote in message
...

As you know, when first being vectored for the ILS, most times the
glideslope will be pegged.


What are you using for guidance when you're being vectored for the ILS?

Nothing, you are on a vector. You have to trust the controller that he (or
she) knows what he's doing and doesn't forget about you. It would be wise to
be situationally aware by using GPS or VOR radials (or other means) to tell
if you are likely to run into rocks.

"S Narayan" wrote in message
news:1129756596.12a76fd6c4f812e4bd3f4ab173da5476@t eranews...

As you know, when first being vectored for the ILS, most times the
glideslope will be pegged.


What are you using for guidance when you're being vectored for the ILS?


Nothing, you are on a vector. You have to trust the controller that he (or
she) knows what he's doing and doesn't forget about you. It would be wise
to be situationally aware by using GPS or VOR radials (or other means) to
tell if you are likely to run into rocks.

Correct. You are not yet using the glideslope or localizer for guidance so
a full deflection of either is meaningless.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

Correct. You are not yet using the glideslope or localizer for guidance so
a full deflection of either is meaningless.

Also, a lot of the high end stuff won't even try to resolve deflections beyond a
certain angle, so the needles are centered with off flags even though there's a
LOC ident.

S Narayan wrote:

Nothing, you are on a vector. You have to trust the controller that he (or
she) knows what he's doing and doesn't forget about you. It would be wise to
be situationally aware by using GPS or VOR radials (or other means) to tell
if you are likely to run into rocks.

TCAS, or even a Garmin 296, removes a lot of concern about rocks during
vectors. A moving map of the MVA would even be better and is being evaluated by
some high-end avionics vendors.

On Thu, 20 Oct 2005 02:02:21 -0700, wrote:


TCAS, or even a Garmin 296, removes a lot of concern about rocks during
vectors.

Rocks have transponders? Cool!

In article .net,
says...


When is it not the right thing to do?




When you are over, or very close to the station - you expect it to go
full-scale, and you have to wait it out a bit. (VOR)

In turbulence, you may see a momentary, full-scale GS needle (it only takes
0.7°, either way). If you see it happen and you are confident in recovering
rapidly. (GS)

When another aircraft passes (or parks!!) in front of the loc emitter, you may
get a momentary spurious deflection. (LOC)

When you are in sight of the runway, and able to make a normal landing, to the
intended runway, using normal maneuvers!


I don't mean to be facetious in stating the "obvious" - but perhaps that's why
there's no specific rule. We are not mechanical "needle-chasers"- we're
expected to understand what we're doing, and exercise good judgment. On the
other hand, if you are in IMC and you have one or the other pegged for some
time, you have not flown the approach to an acceptable standard and the only
logical thing to do is to break it off. Failing to do so may not be a direct
violation of regs the instant the needle goes to the peg, but after some time
you are likely to run afoul of FARs or terrain. G/S high? You haven't busted
minimum altitude, but you haven't flown the published approach either (a
requirement) Too high and you can get a false GS. GS low - no comment.

I see another case where, while you may want to abandon the approach,
you may not want to automatically fly the missed approach. The issue
would be a full L/R deflection, especially significantly before the
MAP, in mountainous terrain. A missed approach procedure which calls
for a left or right climbing turn may put you into the granite, where
the correct option would be to get back closer to the centerline and
maybe closer to the official MAP point first.

This happened to me just the other day. The FAF of a VOR approach is
the station, so the needle goes full deflection as you reach FAF. You
then have to wait until about 1/3 of the way to MAP before it comes
back in. As long as you were stabilized before loosing the needle,
you just have to stick it out. Of course, one problem is that, with
strong winds, you begin your dive at the FAF, winds shift, and you may
very well come out quite a bit off the center.