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"Dan Luke" wrote in message
...

"Matt Barrow" wrote:
Learning right from wrong comes from evolution.

Evolution comes from learning right from wrong.

Both are correct. Populations of organisms "learn" the right way to
survive
in their environments or they perish.

That's nice, but that's not "right from wrong" except on the most extreme
fringe. We're talking morality (self preservation) and ethics (conduct
towards others) which are intellectual pursuits, not biological (though they
are linked).

The ability to do this is coded into
their genes. The coding changes over time due to a combination of
mutation
and natural selection, i.e., by evolution.

Animals have instincts that have developed from evolution. Humans have
reason and, from that, develop principles.

"Matt Barrow" wrote:
in message ...
Both are correct. Populations of organisms "learn" the right way to
survive
in their environments or they perish.

That's nice, but that's not "right from wrong" except on the most
extreme
fringe. We're talking morality (self preservation) and ethics (conduct
towards others) which are intellectual pursuits, not biological
(though they
are linked).

What's the difference? They are both behaviors. Behavior in all
animals is a combination of instinct and learning. It's all biological.

The ability to do this is coded into
their genes. The coding changes over time due to a combination of
mutation
and natural selection, i.e., by evolution.

Animals have instincts that have developed from evolution. Humans have
reason and, from that, develop principles.

Humans have instincts; other animals can reason. It's only a matter of
degree. "Principles" is a fancy name for social behavior useful to the
species.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

mike regish wrote:

"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...

mike regish wrote:


Morality is doing the right thing just because you know it's the right
thing to do, not because you think some magical being is going to strike
you down from above or send you to some imaginary hell.

Who determines what the "right things" are?


In my case, I do. Duh.

Better check the definition again.


That's morality and it doesn't involve religion. It only involves
evolution, something we evidently have a long way to go on. Some more
than others.

Now that is funny. Morality results from evolution. Best one I've heard
in a long time.


Learning right from wrong comes from evolution. Or better said, learning
better ways of doing things...like talking rather than fighting.

If that was the case, then every human would be born with an innate
sense of right and wrong and every generation would have an even more
refined sense of morality at birth. Sorry, doesn't work that way.

Matt

It would if we didn't have religion indoctrinating hatred and bigotry from
day 1.

mike regish

"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...

If that was the case, then every human would be born with an innate sense
of right and wrong and every generation would have an even more refined
sense of morality at birth. Sorry, doesn't work that way.

Matt

mike regish wrote:

It would if we didn't have religion indoctrinating hatred and bigotry from
day 1.

Nice excuse, but lacks creativity. I'll give it a D+. There are
cultures that have virtually no organized religion, but engage in things
such as cannibalism. Is that one of the moral values that evolution
produces?


Matt

On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 21:42:24 -0500, Matt Whiting
wrote:

mike regish wrote:

It would if we didn't have religion indoctrinating hatred and bigotry from
day 1.

Nice excuse, but lacks creativity. I'll give it a D+. There are
cultures that have virtually no organized religion, but engage in things
such as cannibalism. Is that one of the moral values that evolution
produces?


Matt

And there is a recent christian culture that gassed and burned 6
million human beings.

Is that one of the moral values that religion produces?

Just so we're straight here, I'm not talking Darwinian evolution. Modern
civilized man is beyond survival of the fittest since everybody survives
(well, almost) due to advances in medicine. The only genetic evolutionary
steps we really have left are through genetic engineering.

There are no modern cultures (and by modern, I mean technically advanced)
that practice cannibalism that I know of. Any aboriginal cultures (removed
from technical advances) are still evolving both in the Darwinian sense and
intellectually.

Did you indoctrinate your kids in religion from the time they were born or
did you wait until they were old enough to make their own choices? I'm
betting that if you have kids, you raised them in your religion, like all
the middle eastern religions do. Don't want to risk them forming their own
opinions of reality now, do you?

mike regish
(and that IS my real name)

BTW, I don't really give a rats ass what grade you give me.

"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...
mike regish wrote:

It would if we didn't have religion indoctrinating hatred and bigotry
from day 1.

Nice excuse, but lacks creativity. I'll give it a D+. There are cultures
that have virtually no organized religion, but engage in things such as
cannibalism. Is that one of the moral values that evolution produces?


Matt