Bad Engrish?

Thomas Borchert wrote:
It's an easy sentence, agreed. However, it is NOT a sentence in the AIM
nor the Pilot/Controller Glossary or the ICAO standard phraseology. It is
also not the proper way to phrase a question in standard phraseology. It
is plain English, but that doesn't help a foreigner trained to expect
standard aviation phraseology. And THAT is exactly what standard
phraseology is for.

So, to sum up: It's a non-standard phrase and a non-standard way to ask
something. How much LESS standard can it get?

The reg is that you can speak, read, write, and understand English. It
doesn't specify that you only have to know how to understand and respond
to standard phraseology. Understanding English covers the whole
language, not just aviation phraseology.

Shirl,

The reg is that you can speak, read, write, and understand English.


Which one, for someone flying in US airspace, with a foreign
certificate in a foreign-registered aircraft?

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Thomas Borchert writes:

Which one, for someone flying in US airspace, with a foreign
certificate in a foreign-registered aircraft?

ICAO covers all.

On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 16:35:21 -0700, Shirl
wrote in
:

The reg is that you can speak, read, write, and understand English.

Are you able to cite the regulation to which you refer that requires
reading and writing English?

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 29 Jun 2007 16:35:21 -0700, Shirl
wrote in
:

The reg is that you can speak, read, write, and understand English.

Are you able to cite the regulation to which you refer that requires
reading and writing English?


That would involve admitting to a mistake. It will never happen. He'll
either ignore the request entirely, or answer a question you didn't ask.

On 2007-06-29 08:58:49 -0700, Thomas Borchert
said:

Shirl,

How much more standard can it get than, "Were you cleared to the ramp?"


It's an easy sentence, agreed. However, it is NOT a sentence in the AIM
nor the Pilot/Controller Glossary or the ICAO standard phraseology. It is
also not the proper way to phrase a question in standard phraseology. It
is plain English, but that doesn't help a foreigner trained to expect
standard aviation phraseology. And THAT is exactly what standard
phraseology is for.

So, to sum up: It's a non-standard phrase and a non-standard way to ask
something. How much LESS standard can it get?

So what would have been the standard way to ask if he had been cleared
to the ramp?
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

C,

So what would have been the standard way to ask if he had been cleared
to the ramp?


"Confirm you have been cleared to..." or some such. Anything that is not
recognizable as a question by a change in inflection only.

-- e
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

On 2007-06-30 05:34:01 -0700, Thomas Borchert
said:

C,

So what would have been the standard way to ask if he had been cleared
to the ramp?


"Confirm you have been cleared to..." or some such. Anything that is not
recognizable as a question by a change in inflection only.

-- e
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Ah. And his reply would have been so much more clear. "Roger, confirm I
have been cleared to ramp."
--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

Shirl writes:

How much more standard can it get than, "Were you cleared to the ramp?"
The question couldn't GET any more basic than that, and even after
asking four times, the guy *did not understand* that it was a
*question*, NOT a clearance. IMO, that clearly falls under the heading
of not "understanding" English. Not to mention his inability to LISTEN
and comprehend. How many times did the controller have to repeat that he
was saying "Mike/Alpha", NOT November? The guy was so intent on reading
back his instruction that he failed to even HEAR what it was accurately.

Agreed.

Mxsmanic wrote in
news
Shirl writes:

How much more standard can it get than, "Were you cleared to the
ramp?" The question couldn't GET any more basic than that, and even
after asking four times, the guy *did not understand* that it was a
*question*, NOT a clearance. IMO, that clearly falls under the
heading of not "understanding" English. Not to mention his inability
to LISTEN and comprehend. How many times did the controller have to
repeat that he was saying "Mike/Alpha", NOT November? The guy was so
intent on reading back his instruction that he failed to even HEAR
what it was accurately.

Agreed.




Wrong agiasn


Bertie