Jim Leroy went in today...

Kyle Boatright wrote:

I really don't think anyone, even the lowest knuckle dragger wants to see
anyone get killed, which is a very common result of bent sheet metal in the
aviation world.


Nope. The knuckle draggers want to see someone knock on the door of
death and deftly sidestep at the last split second as the beast comes
roaring out. The only proof that death actually comes roaring out is
for the occasional performer to not be quite deft enough. If no one
ever dies, then it gets stale like a carnival ride.

Remember, the job of the carnival ride designer is to make you think
you're going to die while keeping you securely nestled.

On Sun, 29 Jul 2007 12:56:13 -0500, "Jim+Peggy"
wrote:

That means Joe sixpack folks, the NASCAR fans and we all are well aware
what they go to a show to see.

FWIW, I've been to NASCAR Winston and Nextel Cup events that featured
aerobatics as an "opening act". Joe doesn't give a crap about
anything with a propeller. They don't even watch the routine.

Joe Sixpack likes jets.

Watch the non-pilots when the Iron Eagles or Patty Wagstaff fly, then
keep watching when a C-5 or FedEx Airbus does a straight and level low
pass, or especially when the military jet teams perform.

Joe is in the porta-potty or the beer tents while the Pitts, Extra,
Sukoi, and Cap models fly...

I contradict myself.. Joe MIGHT watch a C-130 fly over, even though
it's got propellers. G

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Jul 2007 12:56:13 -0500, "Jim+Peggy"
wrote:

That means Joe sixpack folks, the NASCAR fans and we all are well aware
what they go to a show to see.

FWIW, I've been to NASCAR Winston and Nextel Cup events that featured
aerobatics as an "opening act". Joe doesn't give a crap about
anything with a propeller. They don't even watch the routine.

Joe Sixpack likes jets.

Watch the non-pilots when the Iron Eagles or Patty Wagstaff fly, then
keep watching when a C-5 or FedEx Airbus does a straight and level low
pass, or especially when the military jet teams perform.

Joe is in the porta-potty or the beer tents while the Pitts, Extra,
Sukoi, and Cap models fly...

I contradict myself.. Joe MIGHT watch a C-130 fly over, even though
it's got propellers. G

Interesting. I din't think of that possibility, but it makes a sort of
sense.

Joe Sixpack may be an even smaller bit player than I supposed...

Peter

"Peter Dohm" wrote in message ...

Interesting. I din't think of that possibility, but it makes a sort of
sense.

Joe Sixpack may be an even smaller bit player than I supposed...

Peter



The thing is that RC models do those "3D" routines where they hover and even lower the tail down to the ground, and then
do insane acceleration and rolling and turning. The latest generation of airshow pilot seems to want to mimic that sort
of performance. Pretty amazing to see a Pitts derivative plane break ground and go right in to climbing knife edge
flight. Just as amazing is seeing a Stearman breaking ground and then do a slow roll. I think these folks are doing the
show for the pilots in the crowd. Joe 6pack wants to see the heavy metal and shockwave truck...

In article ,
"Blueskies" wrote:

Just as amazing is seeing a Stearman breaking ground and then do a slow roll.
I think these folks are doing the
show for the pilots in the crowd.

Bob Lycjk (sic) did that in his WACO several years ago and had the
engine quit half way around. Everyone heard it. Bob, being the old pro
that he is, continued the roll, landed and shut down. It was interesting
listening to the conversation on show control when it happened.

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
...

I contradict myself.. Joe MIGHT watch a C-130 fly over, even though
it's got propellers.

Joe likes rocket-powered Freightliner dragsters and Cessna-chomping
Truckasaurii much more than an actual airshow.

The last time I went to an airshow to volunteer with and help keep an eye on
the Tillamook P-38, the show planners had it tucked away behind opaque
plastic next to the WWI-era biplanes. The public had NO idea that any of
that was there except you could just see the tips of the props sticking up
over the barrier.

From the '38 you couldn't see the airshow because of the giant inflatable
beer can or SUV or whatever it was, but it worked out for me because I got
to talk with a 10th Mountain Division WWII vet, cruise around in WWII flight
suit on the hood of a '43 jeep, get a private all-access tour to a
fully-restored B-25, and meet Bob Hoover... ...so maybe I shouldn't
complain. But then again, I was a volunteer so I didn't have to pay to get
in, otherwise I'd have been pretty upset. They had -all- the old warbirds
parked behind a cyclone fence, though, so the public couldn't get closer
than about 20' and you could only see the front of the airplanes.
(Hillsboro, Oregon)

-c

On Jul 30, 2:56 pm, "Gattman" wrote:
"B A R R Y" wrote in messagenews:93aqa3t99ko1i7tcul5rhj73o5365esnut@4ax .com...

I contradict myself.. Joe MIGHT watch a C-130 fly over, even though
it's got propellers.

Joe likes rocket-powered Freightliner dragsters and Cessna-chomping
Truckasaurii much more than an actual airshow.


Hard to believe that Jim went in. Just as it was with Bobby. When I
was first getting started in 2003, I pulled a lot of info from the
Bulldog website. Things like show schedules and contacts, a basic
performer contract, lots of little things that don't matter unless
you're trying to break into the industry and aren't a member of ICAS
yet. I performed at at least one show that he flew and he had an
amazing performance. But IMHO, airshow pilots try to add something new
each year. Outdo the otherguy, go one step farther, maybe just a
little lower, etc. Before long, 2nd order factors become primary order
factors. Things most folks don't understand like altitude density and
humidity creep in and kill people.

In my experience, airshow organizers are looking for the most draw for
their dollar. And general public draw usually equates to "spectacular"
or "bad-ass". "Joe Sixpack" is expecting to see certain things at an
airshow and they are, in order of importance: speed, sound, size,
spins, & smoke. Your show WILL need a jet team, 2 to 5 large military
statics, at least 1 high-power and one low-power solo aerobatic act,
one gimic act such as Robo-sarus or Shockwave, and all the warbirds
you can muster. Everything else, and that includes my plane, is
filler. So goes it with the large shows.

However, many of the smaller shows without huge budgets are willing to
take a change on a non-traditional act. And its at the smaller shows
that I've seen some really interesting flying. It also illustrates an
often-missed point. That mixed in with Joe Sixpack are a lot of
educated folks, many with kids, that come to see the planes, not just
the show. And sometimes they stop for 15 minutes and listen to some
guy in a funny hat talk about a small white plane with no motor that
can barely fly. They take photos, ask questions, and maybe understand
just a little bit more.

Godspeed Jim.

S. D. Harry Frey
Wright Brothers Enterprises

Good post.
It's hard to explain to people outside the community what actually goes
on inside an air show.
I remember one night in Elkton Maryland in 1973 having dinner with
Scotty McCray. I had spent the day working with him just a bit
critiquing his rolls in the Decathlon. This was the week just before he
left to go down to Sao Paulo in Brazil to demonstrate it.
We lost Scotty that week down in South America. One of the finest air
show pilots I have ever known as well as one of the nicest people to be
around.
Scotty of course was an absolute master of unpowered flight. He always
felt that bringing the glider and music together into the demonstration
venue was bringing a little of the beauty we as pilots all knew and
allowing the general public to share it with us.
Dudley Henriques



wright1902glider wrote:
On Jul 30, 2:56 pm, "Gattman" wrote:
"B A R R Y" wrote in messagenews:93aqa3t99ko1i7tcul5rhj73o5365esnut@4ax .com...

I contradict myself.. Joe MIGHT watch a C-130 fly over, even though
it's got propellers.
Joe likes rocket-powered Freightliner dragsters and Cessna-chomping
Truckasaurii much more than an actual airshow.


Hard to believe that Jim went in. Just as it was with Bobby. When I
was first getting started in 2003, I pulled a lot of info from the
Bulldog website. Things like show schedules and contacts, a basic
performer contract, lots of little things that don't matter unless
you're trying to break into the industry and aren't a member of ICAS
yet. I performed at at least one show that he flew and he had an
amazing performance. But IMHO, airshow pilots try to add something new
each year. Outdo the otherguy, go one step farther, maybe just a
little lower, etc. Before long, 2nd order factors become primary order
factors. Things most folks don't understand like altitude density and
humidity creep in and kill people.

In my experience, airshow organizers are looking for the most draw for
their dollar. And general public draw usually equates to "spectacular"
or "bad-ass". "Joe Sixpack" is expecting to see certain things at an
airshow and they are, in order of importance: speed, sound, size,
spins, & smoke. Your show WILL need a jet team, 2 to 5 large military
statics, at least 1 high-power and one low-power solo aerobatic act,
one gimic act such as Robo-sarus or Shockwave, and all the warbirds
you can muster. Everything else, and that includes my plane, is
filler. So goes it with the large shows.

However, many of the smaller shows without huge budgets are willing to
take a change on a non-traditional act. And its at the smaller shows
that I've seen some really interesting flying. It also illustrates an
often-missed point. That mixed in with Joe Sixpack are a lot of
educated folks, many with kids, that come to see the planes, not just
the show. And sometimes they stop for 15 minutes and listen to some
guy in a funny hat talk about a small white plane with no motor that
can barely fly. They take photos, ask questions, and maybe understand
just a little bit more.

Godspeed Jim.

S. D. Harry Frey
Wright Brothers Enterprises