Another YouTube video

At 12:00 10 August 2007, Alex8735 wrote:

or the sex sells approach:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dD-ZIILtI2I

We have something to learn from the Argentinians.

9B

Watching the SSA video was like watching videos of 50ish year old women
holding open canopies on 50ish SGS 2-33's for their 50ish husbands. Not
very exciting and certainly not good for promotion with younger people.

My 21 year old sons favorite video for excitement/promotion is the British
5-8 minute one of flying very close to ridges, low passes, aerobatics and
flying in very close formations. Unfortunately, I can't find the link right
now. The video is something along the lines of
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BjUIFgSZRU posted earlier and may have been
a long version of this video.

It got his attention whereas the SSA one kept his attention .............
for.............twenty...........seconds. Snore.

Doug

"Andy Blackburn" wrote in message
...
At 12:00 10 August 2007, Alex8735 wrote:

or the sex sells approach:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dD-ZIILtI2I

We have something to learn from the Argentinians.

9B

Agreed. Soaring shouldn't be presented as something for the porch swing and
croquet set, which would be, given the current unfortunate soaring
demographics, 'preaching to the choir'. We should make our pitch to the
NEXT generation of pilots - those in their 20's who don't yet know they want
to be glider pilots.

Although many will disagree, soaring is, in fact, an extreme adventure sport
in the mold of mountain climbing and skiing. We need to pitch it as such.

And yes, we can learn something from the Argentines.

Bill Daniels


"Doug" wrote in message
. ..
Watching the SSA video was like watching videos of 50ish year old women
holding open canopies on 50ish SGS 2-33's for their 50ish husbands. Not
very exciting and certainly not good for promotion with younger people.

My 21 year old sons favorite video for excitement/promotion is the British
5-8 minute one of flying very close to ridges, low passes, aerobatics and
flying in very close formations. Unfortunately, I can't find the link
right now. The video is something along the lines of
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BjUIFgSZRU posted earlier and may have
been a long version of this video.

It got his attention whereas the SSA one kept his attention .............
for.............twenty...........seconds. Snore.

Doug

"Andy Blackburn" wrote in message
...
At 12:00 10 August 2007, Alex8735 wrote:

or the sex sells approach:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dD-ZIILtI2I

We have something to learn from the Argentinians.

9B

I believe the British videos lead to/were the result of the "Smokin"
films. I think there's been several variations on those too, the
latest being http://www.liftedfilms.com/ . (I note the description on
the World Juniors film says "the idea was never used..." I wonder why
not?)

Mind you, there's actually good reasons for appealing to the older
demographic, rather than the younger. They tend to have plenty of
money and, post kids, plenty of time. A person who takes up gliding at
50 can be an active member for 20 years or more. Young people tend to
be the opposite - no money, no time. I personally think "targetting" a
particular demographic is a waste of time - make the sport accessible,
and you'll get people of all types rolling up.


Dan

"Dan G" wrote in message
ups.com...
I believe the British videos lead to/were the result of the "Smokin"
films. I think there's been several variations on those too, the
latest being http://www.liftedfilms.com/ . (I note the description on
the World Juniors film says "the idea was never used..." I wonder why
not?)

Mind you, there's actually good reasons for appealing to the older
demographic, rather than the younger. They tend to have plenty of
money and, post kids, plenty of time. A person who takes up gliding at
50 can be an active member for 20 years or more. Young people tend to
be the opposite - no money, no time. I personally think "targetting" a
particular demographic is a waste of time - make the sport accessible,
and you'll get people of all types rolling up.


Dan

Dan, I don't agree. Young people can't be pigeonholed that easily. Some
are poor and have little time but others are in a position to enjoy our
sport. We only need as many as we have gliders and instructors for.

Kids 'make time' for whatever they want to do. Obviously more than a few
have both time and money. Take a look at other extreme outdoor sports and
the marketing. They all pitch expensive sports to young people. They
wouldn't do this if it didn't work.

I think the real problem with youth recruiting is that we just drive them
away with videos like this unfortunate SSA release.

Bill Daniels

The planes in that video look expensive. I wonder why anyone would pay
that kind of money just to take off, fly around for a few minutes, and
then come back and land? Maybe the point of this sport is to have an
after-launch-and-landing-BBQ? Could this be the family angle mentioned
by the yes-I-talk-very-slowly narrator? Very confusing!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgvVA5jXO2E


I think the real problem with youth recruiting is that we just drive them
away with videos like this unfortunate SSA release.

Bill Daniels

Anyone who spends any time on "marketing" will tell you that step 1 is
to carefully segment your market. Having done that, you then figure
out what appeals to each of your segments and market appropriately.
In our case, it's pretty clear that we can/should have many target
markets. What works for the under 25 set may not and probably will
not appeal to the 50 and over set.

My neighbor recently left a cushy corporate marketing job to found his
own firm which specifically targets the under 30 crowd. Recently,
he's been involved in huge marketing efforts for NASCAR. Surprisingly
(at least ot me), NASCAR has an image problem in being perceived as
having a redneck, low income fan base (no offense to anyone who fits
into either or both of those categories). NASCAR wants to get more
advertising and sponsorship dollars from a different group of
companies. They go to a marketing firm which caters to the new
segment to drive interest, which then convinces the sponsoring
companies to sign up.

Anyway, this is a good discussion, since it helps to highlight the
fact that what we're selling depends to some extent on who we're
selling to. It's very hard for the adherents to step out of their
shoes and remember that it may not be easy to convert the great
unwashed.

Anyway, here's to hot chicks, indie rock, and slick video editing
(yeah, I know, I'm in trouble now).

P3

On Aug 13, 4:37 pm, "Bill Daniels" bildan@comcast-dot-net wrote:
"Dan G" wrote in message

ups.com...


Mind you, there's actually good reasons for appealing to the older
demographic, rather than the younger. They tend to have plenty of
money and, post kids, plenty of time. A person who takes up gliding at
50 can be an active member for 20 years or more. Young people tend to
be the opposite - no money, no time. I personally think "targetting" a
particular demographic is a waste of time - make the sport accessible,
and you'll get people of all types rolling up.

Dan

Dan, I don't agree. Young people can't be pigeonholed that easily. Some
are poor and have little time but others are in a position to enjoy our
sport. We only need as many as we have gliders and instructors for.

Kids 'make time' for whatever they want to do. Obviously more than a few
have both time and money. Take a look at other extreme outdoor sports and
the marketing. They all pitch expensive sports to young people. They
wouldn't do this if it didn't work.

I think the real problem with youth recruiting is that we just drive them
away with videos like this unfortunate SSA release.

Bill Daniels- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Aug 13, 10:20 pm, Papa3 wrote:
Anyone who spends any time on "marketing" will tell you that step 1 is
to carefully segment your market. Having done that, you then figure
out what appeals to each of your segments and market appropriately.
In our case, it's pretty clear that we can/should have many target
markets. What works for the under 25 set may not and probably will
not appeal to the 50 and over set.

You can "target" some products, but only if you can tailor the product
to the market. If you can't you start selling a perception, rather
than a reality, which leads to rapid turn-over in members (to keep the
discussion to gliding).

I'm 26, and I fly in a club that happens to have a lot of younger
members, and several women too, so have a good idea of what I'm
talking about, because I'm talking about my friends and myself. There
is a high turnover in the young members in the club - only a *very*
few young people will stick with gliding through their career
advancement and starting a family. Older members have no such
limitations, and typically stacks of cash they're having trouble
spending now their children have flown the nest.

The few young people who stick with gliding for any length of time
almost always receive a lot of money from their parents, one of whom
is usually already a glider pilot. There are not many people in that
category, so it's not worth "targetting" that "market".

(Rock climbing, which is "another extreme outdoor sport" and one that
has a "young" image, is something I used to to, and I reckon that cost
me about 10% of what gliding has for the same period of time. I've
managed to stick with gliding because our club is very cheap, but as a
result has poor facilities, and it's only through drive and
stubborness that I've managed to progress at all. Many of my peers
give up and leave.)

Marketing is almost a side-show; most clubs get plenty of trial flight
customers. Turning them into pilots who stay in the sport for years is
the challenge.

If gliding clubs are interested in expansion there are lots of things
they can do. If you want to know what, the GFA have literally written
the book:

http://www.gfa.org.au/development/guide.php

Download the draft guide from the third box on the right. (There's
also the SSA Growbook, of course, which has lots of good stuff in it
too.)

Clubs have two options: follow the advice of the GFA and SSA and grow,
ignore it and shrink. As the IGC president said earlier this year,
glider pilots will place all the obstacles in the world before
themselves before they'll actually do anything, so I don't expect to
see any clubs following that guide (someone prove me wrong).


Dan

Doug wrote:
My 21 year old sons favorite video for excitement/promotion is the British
5-8 minute one of flying very close to ridges, low passes, aerobatics and
flying in very close formations. Unfortunately, I can't find the link right
now.

Is this the link? http://www.smokinvid.co.uk/

If so, its sold out with apparently no plans to make more copies, though
the website hints that they may be open to persuasion.


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martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
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