What GA needs

On Sep 11, 1:28 pm, Dave J wrote:


I just am tired of hearing about how lazy "kids today" are. People
have been muttering about "kids today" forever. Either man has been on
a constant descent to laziness or stupidity, or much more likely, the
notion is absurd. As tempting as it is to go for the first option, the
second is much more likely.


Every generation has complained about the next generation as being
lazy. I think it has been programmed into our genes.

Gig 601XL Builder writes:

But the rest of your statement basically boils down to not wanting to learn
something complex. And that can be further reduced to instant gratification.

Not instant gratification, but gratification commensurate with the investment
required. Becoming a pilot is a huge investment for anyone who isn't fairly
obsessed with aviation. There are other endeavors that provide much greater
gratification as compared to the investment of time, money, and effort
required to obtain that gratification.

Mxsmanic wrote:
Gig 601XL Builder writes:

But the rest of your statement basically boils down to not wanting
to learn something complex. And that can be further reduced to
instant gratification.

Not instant gratification, but gratification commensurate with the
investment required. Becoming a pilot is a huge investment for
anyone who isn't fairly obsessed with aviation. There are other
endeavors that provide much greater gratification as compared to the
investment of time, money, and effort required to obtain that
gratification.

As usual you have no idea what you are talking about. I'm not obsessed with
aviation. If I were I would have finished the plane I've been building for 5
years a lot sooner.

But it is a good thing you have no desire for gratification at all because
of your mental problems because you have nothing to invest.

Mxsmanic wrote:
Gig 601XL Builder writes:

But the rest of your statement basically boils down to not wanting to learn
something complex. And that can be further reduced to instant gratification.

Not instant gratification, but gratification commensurate with the investment
required. Becoming a pilot is a huge investment for anyone who isn't fairly
obsessed with aviation. There are other endeavors that provide much greater
gratification as compared to the investment of time, money, and effort
required to obtain that gratification.

Are you back again, spouting from your tiny
little point of reference?

How can you claim to have a clue as to what
gratifies others? You never soloed and you
never will so you'll never know. You just
sit at your little screen and figure that
everyone else leads the same pathetic life
with the same pathetic gratification as you.

"Gig 601XL Builder" wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in message
...

But the rest of your statement basically boils down to not wanting to
learn something complex. And that can be further reduced to instant
gratification.

It can also be related to "mental capacity". Our current learning by rote
does not prepare one for learning complexity, nor for expanding on what we
do learn.

Matt Barrow wrote:
"Gig 601XL Builder" wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in message
...

But the rest of your statement basically boils down to not wanting to
learn something complex. And that can be further reduced to instant
gratification.

It can also be related to "mental capacity". Our current learning by
rote does not prepare one for learning complexity, nor for expanding
on what we do learn.

How old are you Matt? I had you pegged at around my age, 45, maybe a little
older.

When I was in school we learned lots of things by rote memorization and I'd
be willing you did to. Multiplication, spelling and the worst of all history
in which they seemed to only care that you remembered the dates things
happened not really why they happened.

I know it's easy to blame all our ills on the current education system but
it is really a lazy approach to the problem. I know to many recent high
school grads that got perfectly good educations despite the problems in the
schools. So maybe we ought to blame the parents of those that don't to at
least some extent.

On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 08:22:51 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in
:


You say that like Fractional ownership is a new thing. It has been around
for years. We just called it partnerships and flying clubs in the past.

You are obviously unaware of the recent regulation changes concerning
fractional ownership. You can start your research he

http://web.nbaa.org/public/ops/fractional/
Fractional Aircraft Ownership Regulation Background & Rulemaking

Fractional ownership operations began in 1986 with the creation of a
program that offered aircraft owners increased flexibility in the
ownership and operation of aircraft. This program used current
aircraft acquisition concepts, including shared or joint aircraft
ownership, and provided for the management of the aircraft by an
aircraft management company.

The aircraft owners participating in the program agreed not only to
share their own aircraft with others having a shared interest in that
aircraft, but also to lease their aircraft to other owners in the
program (dry lease exchange program). The aircraft owners used the
common management company to provide aviation management services
including maintenance of the aircraft, pilot training and assignment,
and administration of the leasing of the aircraft among the owners.

During the 1990's the growth of fractional ownership programs was
substantial and this growth is expected to continue. As these programs
grew in size, complexity and number, there was considerable
controversy within the aviation community as to their appropriate
regulatory structure. Additionally, the FAA had evolving concerns
regarding issues of accountability and responsibility for compliance
(operational control).


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FAA Amends Regulatory Compliance Date for Fractional Operations
On December 14, 2004 the FAA issued a notice that corrects the date by
which all fractional operations must be in compliance with FAR Part
91, Subpart K. NBAA was expecting the correction that changes an
incorrect December 17, 2004, compliance date to February 17, 2005. All
fractional operations will be in compliance with the new rule by the
February 2005 deadline.

Download the notice as it appeared in the Federal Register (52 KB,
PDF)
Federal Register Publishes Fractional Ownership Final Rule
September 17, 2003
On September 17, the FAA's final rule "Regulation of Fractional
Aircraft Ownership Programs and On-Demand Operations" was published.
The rule sets regulatory standards for fractional ownership operations
(Part 91, Subpart K) and updates requirements for on-demand charter
operations (Part 135).

Download the rule as it appeared in the Federal Register (404 KB, PDF)

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 08:22:51 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in
:


You say that like Fractional ownership is a new thing. It has been
around for years. We just called it partnerships and flying clubs in
the past.

You are obviously unaware of the recent regulation changes concerning
fractional ownership. You can start your research he



I'm well aware of it. That doesn't really change the fact that fractional
ownership is an evolution of partnerships and clubs as opposed to a
revolutionary change in ownership. In fact what you posted pretty much
explained how one came from the other.

The reasons regulations had to be propagated was because you basically had
one partnership leasing planes to members of other partnerships. This
basically made fractional ownership a sort of hybrid of clubs and
partnerships.

On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 10:56:01 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in
:

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 08:22:51 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in
:


You say that like Fractional ownership is a new thing. It has been
around for years. We just called it partnerships and flying clubs in
the past.

You are obviously unaware of the recent regulation changes concerning
fractional ownership. You can start your research he



I'm well aware of it.

Well then you've probably noticed that, unlike in the past decades, in
the last few years there are many commercial enterprises and aircraft
manufacturers offering fractional GA aircraft ownership and management
programs:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional_ownership
Aviation
The term fractional ownership originally became popular for
business jets. Richard Santulli of NetJets pioneered the concept
of allowing businesses to purchase shares in a jet to reduce costs
— other companies such as Citation Shares, Flight Options and
Flexjet soon followed. With a fractional jet plan, members will
typically fly in any jet available, not necessarily the one in
which they own shares. The management company will reposition jets
as necessary and provide flight crews. Companies with greater
needs purchase larger shares to get access to more time.

The fractional-ownership concept has since been extended to
smaller aircraft and has now become common for single-engine
piston aircraft like the Cirrus SR22, which are beyond the
financial means of many private pilots. The same concepts apply,
except that the management company may not provide flight crews
nor reposition the aircraft.

Fractional ownership has played a significant role in revitalizing
the general aviation manufacturing industry since the late 1990s,
and most manufacturers actively support fractional ownership
programs.

http://www.netjets.com/
http://www.aircraftinvestmentgroup.com/article_01.htm
http://www.tsbureau.com/fractionalaircraftownership.htm

That doesn't really change the fact that fractional
ownership is an evolution of partnerships and clubs as opposed to a
revolutionary change in ownership. In fact what you posted pretty much
explained how one came from the other.

The reasons regulations had to be propagated was because you basically had
one partnership leasing planes to members of other partnerships. This
basically made fractional ownership a sort of hybrid of clubs and
partnerships.

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 10:56:01 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in
:

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 08:22:51 -0500, "Gig 601XL Builder"
wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote in
:


You say that like Fractional ownership is a new thing. It has been
around for years. We just called it partnerships and flying clubs
in the past.

You are obviously unaware of the recent regulation changes
concerning fractional ownership. You can start your research he



I'm well aware of it.

Well then you've probably noticed that, unlike in the past decades, in
the last few years there are many commercial enterprises and aircraft
manufacturers offering fractional GA aircraft ownership and management
programs:



Are you being dense Larry or just your standard asshole self? YOu can quote
all the Wki sites you like. That doesn't change the fact that fractional
ownership is just an evolution of partnerships and flying clubs.