$98 per barrel oil

all those cost serveral
times what conventional electricity costs and the odds of making the
costs comparable to coventional methods is slim.


To come back to the start of the thread: we're getting there...

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Thomas Borchert wrote:
all those cost serveral
times what conventional electricity costs and the odds of making the
costs comparable to coventional methods is slim.


To come back to the start of the thread: we're getting there...

Not really.

With heroic effort we've managed to get the cost of "alternate"
sources of electricity down to 2 to 4 times what conventional
electricity costs, with the best costs being in the limited areas
where the alernates are optimized, for example solar power in very
sunny locations.



--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

wrote in :

Thomas Borchert wrote:
all those cost serveral
times what conventional electricity costs and the odds of making the
costs comparable to coventional methods is slim.


To come back to the start of the thread: we're getting there...

Not really.

With heroic effort we've managed to get the cost of "alternate"
sources of electricity down to 2 to 4 times what conventional
electricity costs, with the best costs being in the limited areas
where the alernates are optimized, for example solar power in very
sunny locations.


The effort can hardly be charaecterised as heroic and your figures are
incorrect since the costs of fossil fuel and nuke doesn't include the
borrowing involved.


Bertie

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
wrote in :

Thomas Borchert wrote:
all those cost serveral
times what conventional electricity costs and the odds of making the
costs comparable to coventional methods is slim.


To come back to the start of the thread: we're getting there...

Not really.

With heroic effort we've managed to get the cost of "alternate"
sources of electricity down to 2 to 4 times what conventional
electricity costs, with the best costs being in the limited areas
where the alernates are optimized, for example solar power in very
sunny locations.


The effort can hardly be charaecterised as heroic and your figures are
incorrect since the costs of fossil fuel and nuke doesn't include the
borrowing involved.

"Fossil" fuels have nothing to do with nuclear energy.

The cost of electric production by nuclear energy includes the total
life cycle cost of a nuclear facility if the numbers are honestly
derived.

The total life cycle is everything from the first study to the last
cleanup on shutdown.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

wrote in :

Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
wrote in
:

Thomas Borchert wrote:
all those cost serveral
times what conventional electricity costs and the odds of making
the costs comparable to coventional methods is slim.


To come back to the start of the thread: we're getting there...

Not really.

With heroic effort we've managed to get the cost of "alternate"
sources of electricity down to 2 to 4 times what conventional
electricity costs, with the best costs being in the limited areas
where the alernates are optimized, for example solar power in very
sunny locations.


The effort can hardly be charaecterised as heroic and your figures
are incorrect since the costs of fossil fuel and nuke doesn't include
the borrowing involved.

"Fossil" fuels have nothing to do with nuclear energy.



The cost of electric production by nuclear energy includes the total
life cycle cost of a nuclear facility if the numbers are honestly
derived.


Nope.



The total life cycle is everything from the first study to the last
cleanup on shutdown.


But not the storage of the fuel or the cleanup of the damage done by it.


Talk to me again if the experiment at Cadarache succeeds, otherwise, you
can keep them.


Bertie

On 2007-11-08, wrote:
Electric transportation will never be viable until and unless a dramatic
advance in battery technology is made that will enable electric cars
to go 200-400 miles and power all the trucks on the interstate.

To be pedantic, *personal* electric transportation. Over here in
Rightpondia, electric transportation has been viable for frieght and
mass transport for decades. Here's a picture of such transport hauling a
load of frieght:
http://jasonrodhouse.fotopic.net/p43333298.html

Aviation is probably the hardest nut to crack - it requires a portable
and highly energy dense fuel - batteries probably never will crack it.
It'll always need a fuel with similar energy density characteristics as
diesel or gasoline.

--
From the sunny Isle of Man.
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.

Dylan Smith writes:

Aviation is probably the hardest nut to crack - it requires a portable
and highly energy dense fuel - batteries probably never will crack it.
It'll always need a fuel with similar energy density characteristics as
diesel or gasoline.

Hydrogen springs to mind, but storing it safely and in small volumes is
problmatic.

Mxsmanic wrote in
:

Dylan Smith writes:

Aviation is probably the hardest nut to crack - it requires a portable
and highly energy dense fuel - batteries probably never will crack it.
It'll always need a fuel with similar energy density characteristics as
diesel or gasoline.

Hydrogen springs to mind, but storing it safely and in small volumes is
problmatic.


Been done, fjukkwit.



Bertie

Dylan Smith wrote:
On 2007-11-08, wrote:
Electric transportation will never be viable until and unless a dramatic
advance in battery technology is made that will enable electric cars
to go 200-400 miles and power all the trucks on the interstate.

To be pedantic, *personal* electric transportation. Over here in
Rightpondia, electric transportation has been viable for frieght and
mass transport for decades. Here's a picture of such transport hauling a
load of frieght:
http://jasonrodhouse.fotopic.net/p43333298.html

Sure, it works great in some circumstances, especially when the
distances are trivial.

How do you get lettuce from the field in Fresno to the supermarket
in San Diego, much less Chicago?

Aviation is probably the hardest nut to crack - it requires a portable
and highly energy dense fuel - batteries probably never will crack it.
It'll always need a fuel with similar energy density characteristics as
diesel or gasoline.

--
From the sunny Isle of Man.
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

writes:

Sure, it works great in some circumstances, especially when the
distances are trivial.

Distances aren't that much of a problem, and many electrified lines extend for
great distances.

Additionally, a small fraction of a network tends to handle a large fraction
of the traffic, and only that small fraction need be electrified.

The advantage of electrification is that you can haul heavier loads with
electric locomotives.