Owner's Manual Format

RST Engineering wrote:
We've been absorbing costs for about five years and just can't afford
to do it any longer. Two choices. Increase price or decrease costs.

For those that require a manual in the airplane, it is cheaper for
you to print it out on your inkjet than for us to use a copy service.

Jim



Jim, and I say this from a publishing background and the owner of laser and
inkjet printers, Bull****.

I can not print off a copy with an ink-jet or even laser printer cheaper
than you can have them printed. If I can you really need to find another
printer because you are getting screwed. And after you find a printer that
isn't bending you over you still need to increase the price do so.

"Gig 601XL Builder" wrote:
RST Engineering wrote:
We've been absorbing costs for about five years and just can't afford
to do it any longer. Two choices. Increase price or decrease costs.

For those that require a manual in the airplane, it is cheaper for
you to print it out on your inkjet than for us to use a copy service.

Jim

Jim, and I say this from a publishing background and the owner of
laser and inkjet printers, Bull****.

I can not print off a copy with an ink-jet or even laser printer
cheaper than you can have them printed. If I can you really need to
find another printer because you are getting screwed. And after you
find a printer that isn't bending you over you still need to increase
the price do so.

A "copy service" isn't for oneses or twoses, you do a run. To do that
you have to anticipate the future market for your kits. Parts have to be
bulk ordered, circuit boards made. Its alot to ask of 2 people who
already have their @sses on the line and are trying to save you a few
bucks. Plus you have to store all of the above, printed materials
included...

Apparently you have no concept of what postage costs either. That gets
factored in when you add weight and still want to be competitive with
the same widget thats already put together...

And since he's providing the circuit diagrams in .pdf format, that
allows others to simply roll-their-own, with no need to buy anything
from RST at all...

There may be a middle option ... separate the operator's manual from
the installation / maint / troubleshooting / detailed / programming
guide or whatever you want to call it.

If a one page describes how to perform most functions (I have seen
'howto' lists and tree navigation diagrams work well) then THIS
becomes the operators manual. This would keep the spirit of the
requirement.

When I am flying I do not want to have a large manual or navigate a CD
to learn how to perform an operation. It is probable that if I am in
this situation (learning equipment whilst airborne) then I may have
other issues to deal with and I am just increasing my workload.
Scanning a tree diagram (sorry, operations manual) is an acceptable
workload and the sign of well designed equipment. Anything else is
either because (i) I am playing with details of a non-critical
component or activity and should probably stop (ii) I have failed to
be familiar with a critical operation / equipment - this is poor
planning / decision making and I should not be flying this
configuration or (iii) the equipment is not suitably designed for
cockpit operations. Jim - your equipment does not fall into category
(iii).

Construction, learning capabilities, detailed programming,
configuration &c. should be ground operations - PDF / CD / print the
sections that you need should all work well. I use this criteria for
purchasing equipment and in my own construction.

A one pager for operations would be great. I'd hate to see great
products suffer because of the need to have trees fly instead of
letting them continue to produce oxygen and fuel.

Best Regards
Steve

Because a lot of our customers are technotards.

Jim

--
"If you think you can, or think you can't, you're right."
--Henry Ford


"Richard Riley" wrote in message
...

Why bother with the CD? Just post PDFs on your website. Your cost
for the bandwidth of one customer downloading is cheaper than the cost
of duplicating, handling and shipping a CD (not that it's high either
way)

? They can build kit avionics but they can't open a pdf file and print
it (if they so desire)? I think having manuals on a company website is
a real bonus. CDs can get misplaced or lost in moves, etc. It's always
nice to know you can always go to the "manufacturer" via their website
and retrieve a lost manual quickly...


RST Engineering wrote:
Because a lot of our customers are technotards.

Jim


--
Scott
http://corbenflyer.tripod.com/
Gotta Fly or Gonna Die
Building RV-4 (Super Slow Build Version)

RST Engineering wrote:
Because a lot of our customers are technotards.


So they are going to have trouble printing out a copy on their inkjet
printer.

There is no indication that CD's will last 50 years banging around in
a flight bag, being tossed into the baggage compartment, thrown on a
shelf in the hangar where they go from 20 below to 120 degrees over
and over through the years...... I have printed manuals on Fat Albert
that are that old and have ... THey still boot up just fine...
Also, I cannot balance a CD on my tummy in bed and read it.. I vote
for the manufacturers to be required to supply a printed manual on
dead trees...

denny

There is no indication that CD's will last 50 years banging around in
a flight bag, being tossed into the baggage compartment, thrown on a
shelf in the hangar where they go from 20 below to 120 degrees over
and over through the years

They probably won't. Then again, how many pieces of avionics do you have in
the airplane that are 50 years old? 40? 30? 20, perhaps.


....... I have printed manuals on Fat Albert
that are that old and have ... THey still boot up just fine...
Also, I cannot balance a CD on my tummy in bed and read it..

So you are interested in assessing everybody who buys the equipment to pay a
$5 tax because you want a printed manual? That doesn't seem hardly fair,
does it? You want a full manual? Print your own from the CD. You only
need chapters C and G, print just C and G.


I vote
for the manufacturers to be required to supply a printed manual on
dead trees...

Ya know, one of the privileges of being in the manufacturing game is that
the customer can't "require" anything. You are perfectly welcome to vote
with your pocketbook, but you can't "require" anything.

Jim

RST Engineering wrote:

Ya know, one of the privileges of being in the manufacturing game is that
the customer can't "require" anything. You are perfectly welcome to vote
with your pocketbook, but you can't "require" anything.

Jim



Didn't this whole thread start Jim with you asking us our opinion on the
issue? And your privilege is only for those manufactures like yourself
that are selling ones and twos to a bunch of customers. Try doing
business with Wal-Mart and tell me how they can't require that you do
something.

Well, Jim is a grump when anyone disagrees with him, especially me..
Second, he is correct that the customer can vote with his feet - once
it becomes known on the chat groups that a manufacturer is a grumpass
who is not friendly after the sale...

The issue for Jim, is that the cost of a printed manual is a
significant fraction of the total price of his product.. And, what I
am reading betwen the lines is that he is hooked on the horns of a
dilemma where raising the price of his product will reduce sales
because his customers are looking for a cheap solution to their
needs, but continuing to supply a printed manual reduces his profit
margin below a sustainable level...
So he sees a solution as being either a CD or preferably a web site
with a down load PDF... But then, he laments that his customers are
'technotards' who aren't lining up in droves to save him money...
uummm,welcome to the real world, Jim

OK, I could on on for half of a thick book with trendline analysis,
similar product studies, etc., etc... But I don't see many of you as
being willing to read it...

The readers digest version is that Jim needs to change to a web based
site with download PDF files.... Make it clear in the sales literature
that the schematics, board photos, and the step by step instructions
are only available that way... For those who are total technotards,
also have a mechanism where they can call up InstyPrint, et. al. and
buy a manual shipped by express mail... Yes, this will impact your
sales, but not as much as a 15% or 20% increase in selling price....

denny