What would you buy with a 50k budget?

B A R R Y wrote:


That's not how I read it at all. He said "efficiency".

Exactly.



Lots of folks only look at GPH, and don't give airspeed or the typical
load, proper attention.

There are airplanes that are a lot faster for just a tad more fuel,
especially with a light load. In reality, more efficient.

To compare apples to apples you have to do MPG. I had a 67 182, at top
of the green, 23"/2450, it would indicate about 135 MPH in the summer
and about 140 in the winter at 4500 feet(11 mpg). That's burning about
12 to 12.5. In the Bo I indicate 145-150 MPH at 8.5 GPH at my 45%
setting of 19"/2100(17.5 mpg). At 75% like the 182 the mpg drops to 13
but your going 55 mph faster.

On Sun, 18 May 2008 15:40:57 -0600, Newps wrote:


And remember, when you start looking at fuel burns most people don't
look at gas mileage, only how much an airplane can burn. Then
inevitably they pick something like a 172, 182 or a Cherokee that are
inefficient.

A terrific point.

GPH is only half of the equation when actually going places.

Kirk Ellis wrote:
..


Are half century old airplanes still viable machines? It sounds scary
buying something that is almost as old as I am.


Never fly anything younger than you are, someone has to have experience :-)

More to the point a well maintained older airplane is just fine. Mines
a 1950 and until the engine swallowed a valve it was just fine. We had
an odd-ball engine (GO-435) and decided to reengine, then we just kept
going, but if the budget had been tighter we really didn't have to all
the stuff we did to the plane (new just about everything). I like Jim's
idea of buying a decent, but ragged out plane and fixing something every
year (if you have the time to work on it without negatively impacting
flying time too much). Ideally a nice long "vacation" period that goes
to the airplane is great.

Margy

fLY WITH A SENIOUR HE KNOWS HOW TO STAY ALIVE!Margy Natalie brought
next idea :
Never fly anything younger than you are, someone has to have experience :-)

Kirk Ellis wrote:

Are half century old airplanes still viable machines? It sounds scary
buying something that is almost as old as I am.

Mines 55. '53 Pacer that starts getting all new skin this week. Thats
not a pricey as a new engine, but it sure ain't cheap either. New sealed
struts (kills a repetative AD), new windshield, avionics upgrades, also
new wheels, brakes, tires and a paint job when its all done. Then I'll
consider a topend (135hp Lycosaurus)...

My wing internals look brand new, as does the airframe. Geauxing through
the logbooks, lots of stuff (tailwheels, pulleys, cables, wiring,
instruments, never a complete fabric job though) has been replaced
during those 55 years thats kept it in the good shape its still in.
Course its easy to see everything when its naked. Pretty tough to do
with the average spamcan...

The point about the cash is well taken. I may be able to work that
out....of course the "partner" I share the boat with will have
something to say about the equity line of credit.

If I had to rethink it, probably a partnership in a decent retractable
single engined Beech spamcan (just like Newps) or a flying club (ours
had shutdown, had an old Cardinal). I've been in the Lancair's and
flying faster than 240 mph (on 17 gph @ 18k') sure is nice when from
here to there is a far piece (crossing 4 or more states, especially one
like Texas)...

Kirk Ellis explained :
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Newps wrote:


$50K budget for a cross country machine that won't eat you alive with
fuel bills? Late 50's Bonanza. 180-185 MPH on 11-12 GPH. 150 MPH on
8.5 GPH. Mine's a 64 and I have a bigger engine but the airframes are
basically the same. I would guesstimate $1000-1500 per year in
maintenence outside the annual.

Well, Scott, as the owner of a '49 Bonanza, I'm not so sure I'm so sanguine.

Performance wise, I usually figure 155 MPH on 9.5 GPH so I won't quibble
with you there. But I really think the maintenence between my A model
is can be signifantly different from your S model. Parts for the E-series
engine are becoming difficult. Better hope you don't need parts for the
electric prop or the Hartzel for that matter. Very expensive, if you can
find them at all.

It really also doen't take much to blow the $1000-$1500 in non-annual
maintenace. Priced out a cabin door hinge? Six years ago I spent $500
for a SALVAGED one. An and older plane is just going to have had more
time for things to wear out.

Good thing I've been in love with this hunk of metal for the past 15 years.
It would be tough to justify at this point.

--
Frank Stutzman
Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl"
Boise, ID

Frank Stutzman wrote:
Newps wrote:

$50K budget for a cross country machine that won't eat you alive with
fuel bills? Late 50's Bonanza. 180-185 MPH on 11-12 GPH. 150 MPH on
8.5 GPH. Mine's a 64 and I have a bigger engine but the airframes are
basically the same. I would guesstimate $1000-1500 per year in
maintenence outside the annual.

Well, Scott, as the owner of a '49 Bonanza, I'm not so sure I'm so sanguine.

Performance wise, I usually figure 155 MPH on 9.5 GPH so I won't quibble
with you there. But I really think the maintenence between my A model
is can be signifantly different from your S model. Parts for the E-series
engine are becoming difficult. Better hope you don't need parts for the
electric prop or the Hartzel for that matter. Very expensive, if you can
find them at all.

Right, I wouldn't touch an A model(1949) with a 10 foot pole. Stick to
the late 50's or newer like I said and you get at least an IO-470 and no
prop issues. Same basic engine and prop that's in a 182.

Newps wrote:

Right, I wouldn't touch an A model(1949) with a 10 foot pole. Stick to
the late 50's or newer like I said and you get at least an IO-470 and no
prop issues. Same basic engine and prop that's in a 182.

Just to add a few more tedious details...

The H model came out in '57 with an odd O-470-G (I'm not sure its used in
airframe) that was carbed. The J model came out in '58 with a more common
injected IO-470-C.

So how much can you spend on a J model Bonanza? I dunno for sure, as I
don't pay too much attention generally. However, I did a 2 minute glance
around the 'net and the cheapest asking price I could find was $55,000.
Given the current market, one could probably could find something cheaper,
but somehow I don't think it would be a lot cheaper.

Besides the very early models (35,A35,B35) are the best flying Bonanzas.
I know because Old Bob told me so ;-) (its an inside joke).

--
Frank Stutzman
Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl"
Boise, ID

Sorry post posting proof-reading:

Frank Stutzman wrote:

The H model came out in '57 with an odd O-470-G (I'm not sure its used in
airframe) that was carbed. The J model came out in '58 with a more common
injected IO-470-C.

Should read:

The H model came out in '57 with an odd O-470-G (I'm not sure its used in
ANOTHER airframe) that was carbed. The J model came out in '58 with a
more common injected IO-470-C.

--
Frank Stutzman
Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl"
Boise, ID