Mechanics of Elevator Trim. In Detail.

Le Chaud Lapin wrote in news:964c4756-a3b3-43c5-
:

On Jun 9, 10:58*am, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jun 8, 10:20*am, Le Chaud Lapin wrote:

On Jun 8, 11:07*am, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
For sake of those of us who only own MSFS, let's say a C172.

What does MSFS have to do with anything. This is a pilot news group,
not sim. There are sim groups out there that would be more appropriate
for your question.

MSFS was the means by which I discovered the mechanism.


No it isn't.

If I had learned in actual aircraft, the question still would have
been relevant.

Not if you'd asked it. And not in the way it was asked.


Bertie

On Jun 9, 9:34*am, Le Chaud Lapin wrote:

MSFS was the means by which I discovered the mechanism.

If I had learned in actual aircraft, the question still would have
been relevant.

I disagree. I've never had a student have trouble understanding trim.
I think this is just something that is confusing for the sim guys. As
such it is more approporiate for a sim group, not a pilot's group.

-Robert, CFII

On Jun 9, 1:06*pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jun 9, 9:34*am, Le Chaud Lapin wrote:

MSFS was the means by which I discovered the mechanism.

If I had learned in actual aircraft, the question still would have
been relevant.

I disagree. I've never had a student have trouble understanding trim.
I think this is just something that is confusing for the sim guys. As
such it is more approporiate for a sim group, not a pilot's group.

I never had trouble undestanding it. My ground school instructor said
what was written in the Jeppesen book and moved on.

I think if the book said more about how it worked, there would be no
misunderstanding.

-Le Chaud Lapin-

On Jun 9, 11:31*am, Le Chaud Lapin wrote:
On Jun 9, 1:06*pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:

I think if the book said more about how it worked, there would be no
misunderstanding.

I think if you walked up to an actual airplane there would be no
misunderstanding.

-Robert

On Jun 9, 6:19*pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jun 9, 11:31*am, Le Chaud Lapin wrote:

On Jun 9, 1:06*pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
I think if the book said more about how it worked, there would be no
misunderstanding.

I think if you walked up to an actual airplane there would be no
misunderstanding.

My first experience with trim control was neither with a book or a
plane, but with the instructor. I think there are a lot of things
that students are assumed to know that they do not, which can be
frustrating, as there is no difficult in the concepts, but the
ommission of facts, which hurts more than helps. It is the
instructor's choice to determine how deep s/he should delve into the
mechanics of flight.

One instructor might say, "Move trim wheel up or down to relieve
pressure on yoke."

Another might say, "Trim wheel is connected to a trim tab on elevator,
often located on one side of elevator only, and air moving across
elevator results in aerodynamic force vector on tab that acts on
elevator to position elevator so that point of equilibrium is reached,
and such force being sufficient that you no longer need the yoke to
position the elevator. As you can imagine, speed and orientation of
aircraft will have some effect on force...and therefore position of
elevator. Also, if only one tab, force applies asymetrically to
aircraft...etc."

Both these explanations are true, but one of them eliminates the need
for $30 product (or $30,000 aircraft) to know what is going on.

-Le Chaud Lapin-

Le Chaud Lapin wrote in news:6b0f0604-da90-4433-
:

On Jun 9, 1:06*pm, "Robert M. Gary" wrote:
On Jun 9, 9:34*am, Le Chaud Lapin wrote:

MSFS was the means by which I discovered the mechanism.

If I had learned in actual aircraft, the question still would have
been relevant.

I disagree. I've never had a student have trouble understanding trim.
I think this is just something that is confusing for the sim guys. As
such it is more approporiate for a sim group, not a pilot's group.

I never had trouble undestanding it.

Yes, you have and stil do.


Bertie

Le Chaud Lapin wrote:

MSFS was the means by which I discovered the mechanism.

If I had learned in actual aircraft, the question still would have
been relevant.

-Le Chaud Lapin-



You never learned of trim until MSFS and you are going to design an
airplane. Fabulous!

On Jun 9, 1:19*pm, Gig 601Xl Builder
wrote:
Le Chaud Lapin wrote:
MSFS was the means by which I discovered the mechanism.

If I had learned in actual aircraft, the question still would have
been relevant.

-Le Chaud Lapin-

You never learned of trim until MSFS and you are going to design an
airplane. Fabulous!

Is it really necessary to understand the particular way it was done in
C172 to achieve the same result?

The same thing could be achieved using more electronics, less
mechanics, and the controls might be entirely different.

-Le Chaud Lapin-

Le Chaud Lapin wrote:
On Jun 9, 1:19 pm, Gig 601Xl Builder
wrote:
Le Chaud Lapin wrote:
MSFS was the means by which I discovered the mechanism.
If I had learned in actual aircraft, the question still would have
been relevant.
-Le Chaud Lapin-
You never learned of trim until MSFS and you are going to design an
airplane. Fabulous!

Is it really necessary to understand the particular way it was done in
C172 to achieve the same result?

The same thing could be achieved using more electronics, less
mechanics, and the controls might be entirely different.

-Le Chaud Lapin-

Not knowing about trim by someone who thinks they are going to design an
airplane is like someone who wants to be an electrician and doesn't
understand the difference in AC and DC.

It's just another example that you have no business trying to design an
aircraft.

On Jun 9, 3:30*pm, Gig 601Xl Builder
wrote:
Not knowing about trim by someone who thinks they are going to design an
airplane is like someone who wants to be an electrician and doesn't
understand the difference in AC and DC.

It's just another example that you have no business trying to design an
aircraft.

This is a false analogy.

It depends on what is meant by "knowing about trim". The purpose of
trim is clear, and the objective of trim can be achieved in many
ways.

It is not necessary to know all the ways that the objective of trim
can be achieved in order to implement just one mechanism that achieves
the objective.

-Le Chaud Lapin-