Air America breaking news: "USA to fingerprint ALL visitors !!!"

Alan Pollock wrote:
Seriously, driver's licenses are used as ID in the US.

You know, I am amazed at the transformation of the USA. In the past, the mere
mention of a national identity card would make the republicans rabid,
professing that such a card would infringe on the rights of freedom and
liberty (etc etc).

It is interesting that those very same people today are calling anyone who is
against the current regime's measures "unpatriotic" even those measures
actually do infronge on many of the basic principles of the USA (right to fair
trial, innocent until proven guilty etc).

While a citizen has some power over his government in case of abuses, a
visitor does not. So if the US regime misuses its own citizens information,
you can eventually boot them out (or even impeach them). But for travellers,
they have no such right.

This is especially true when a regime does not have modern data privacy laws
and can essentially do as it wishes with the personal data it collects.

Lets turn the tables around: lets say that the Taliban had required all
visitors to be fingerprinted and photographed when they visited Afghanistan.
Then, they would choose an american indentity at random and proceed to murder
some prominent person in the USA, making sure that they leave some innocent
person's fingerprints as well as wearing a mask making the real guilty person
look like the innocent.


That is why, if you are going to leave personal information with a government,
you must have trust that the government will not misuse that information. The
current USA regime has broken that trust because it has misused the information.

Look at the Jetblue personal information which had been meant to stay within
one department for study, but not only spread to other departments, but was
also handed over to some consulting firm that not only analysed the data but
also displayed privated information in their examples during a presentation at
a conference.

In nobody wrote:

That is why, if you are going to leave personal information with a
government, you must have trust that the government will not misuse that
information. The current USA regime has broken that trust because it has
misused the information.

As did the one before it, and the one before that, and the one before that
and ...

As will the one that follows it.

--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN

"Bert Hyman" wrote in message
...
In nobody wrote:

That is why, if you are going to leave personal information with a
government, you must have trust that the government will not misuse that
information. The current USA regime has broken that trust because it has
misused the information.

As did the one before it, and the one before that, and the one before that
and ...

As will the one that follows it.


I hope you are wrong or we will never be willing to return to the USA.

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 15:48:59 -0400, nobody wrote:

Alan Pollock wrote:
Seriously, driver's licenses are used as ID in the US.

You know, I am amazed at the transformation of the USA. In the past, the mere
mention of a national identity card would make the republicans rabid,
professing that such a card would infringe on the rights of freedom and
liberty (etc etc).

It is interesting that those very same people today are calling anyone who is
against the current regime's measures "unpatriotic" even those measures
actually do infronge on many of the basic principles of the USA (right to fair
trial, innocent until proven guilty etc).


Patriotism can be a great force for good and bad. Throughout history
extremists on the left and the right have used it to their advantage.
--==++AJC++==--

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 23:27:54 +0200, AJC wrote:

Patriotism can be a great force for good and bad. Throughout history
extremists on the left and the right have used it to their advantage.

Excitation of nationalist feelings is always bad. "Patriotism" is just a
convenient word to make it sound otherwise.

No matter what, it's an "us vs. them" thing.

"devil" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 23:27:54 +0200, AJC wrote:

Patriotism can be a great force for good and bad. Throughout history
extremists on the left and the right have used it to their advantage.

Excitation of nationalist feelings is always bad. "Patriotism" is just a
convenient word to make it sound otherwise.

No matter what, it's an "us vs. them" thing.



The Frenc have a word for it: chauvinism. That is what we are seeing in the
USA now: "my leader right or wrong!"

ML

Here in rec.travel.air,
"Marie Lewis" spake unto us, saying:

The Frenc have a word for it: chauvinism. That is what we are seeing
in the USA now: "my leader right or wrong!"

The majority of people that I know in my area of the US are simply not
in agreement with many of the current administration's policies, and
some are in very strong disagreement.

I find it somewhat shocking that citizens of the US are being portrayed
as all lining up behind their leadership. That simply isn't happening.

--
-Rich Steiner --- http://www.visi.com/~rsteiner --- Eden Prairie, MN
OS/2 + eCS + Linux + Win95 + DOS + PC/GEOS + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven!
Applications analyst/designer/developer (14 yrs) seeking employment.
See web site above for resume/CV and background.

On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 10:01:28 +0100, Marie Lewis wrote:


"devil" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 23:27:54 +0200, AJC wrote:

Patriotism can be a great force for good and bad. Throughout history
extremists on the left and the right have used it to their advantage.

Excitation of nationalist feelings is always bad. "Patriotism" is just a
convenient word to make it sound otherwise.

No matter what, it's an "us vs. them" thing.



The Frenc have a word for it: chauvinism. That is what we are seeing in the
USA now: "my leader right or wrong!"

That's not really what chauvinism is though.

Chauvinism is more like a grassroot feeling that "we" are the center of
the universe. A belly button thing. Sure, beside France, there are a
number of parochial places like that, usually realtively large countries,
which the world is perceived as far away from. Among places where I lived
that felt like that, obvious places include Brazil and the US. With
France retaining its benchmark status of course.

Marie Lewis wrote:

"devil" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 23:27:54 +0200, AJC wrote:

Patriotism can be a great force for good and bad. Throughout history
extremists on the left and the right have used it to their advantage.

Excitation of nationalist feelings is always bad. "Patriotism" is just a
convenient word to make it sound otherwise.

No matter what, it's an "us vs. them" thing.

The Frenc have a word for it: chauvinism. That is what we are seeing in the
USA now: "my leader right or wrong!" ML

You see that mostly in the minority who supported him prior to his
selection. Those who opposed his selection are still pretty ****ed. FFM

JF Mezei wrote in message
...

Alan Pollock wrote:
Seriously, driver's licenses are used as ID in the US.

You know, I am amazed at the transformation of the USA. In the past, the
mere
mention of a national identity card would make

There is no national identity card in the US, JF. Nor is this discussion
about national identity cards. I realize that you spend most of your time
trolling newsgroups, but that doesn't excuse your ignorance.