A proposal to increase membership, cross-country pilots, competitors,and world champions (USA).

Andy Gough: thank you for the translation :-)
You got the gist of the message out clear.

First, the official contact:
Karkonoskie Stowarzyszenie Szybowcowe
ul DÅ‚uga 61
58-521 Jeżów Sudecki
Poland


http://www.kssjezow.pl/pl/
(there is an English version there as well, but Polish is current)

I will edit/translate the syllabus/description of one of the past camps and post it here ASAP (as requested by Kevin). All specific questions might be best answered at the address listed above, I am writing this (authorized) post as one of community members benefiting from KSS activity, but I will try to get here directly as much info and feedback as possible. This (KSS) initiative works, I have seen it firsthand.

Some of (my own) comments:

There seem to be a perception in the US of a big difference/barrier between local and XC flight. This is how I read posts here. But another perception is possible. Here in Poland one CANNOT get license without doing at least one short XC. Students do them, it is seen as normal (I do not claim casual, students and instructors prepare seriously). But there is no perception "local is fun, XC is hard work". I repeat, no perception barrier. Student train (syllabus) for outfield landings, precision landings, down/cross wind landings, from above high obstacle landings etc. Students outland moderately often (this is considered error given small distances involved, but accepted grudgingly, with everybody respecting the "1000ft? - LAND!" rule). Ships sometimes get damaged, injuries are rare. But we know what business we are in.

Do not think XC requires fancy ships. We do much XC training using L/D30 (theoretical) wooden SZD-30. It used to be a matter of honor to do diamond distance on an L/D 30 ship before flying some better machine. Do not think XC=private owners. Most of my fellow club members who do XC do not own any ship (hard thing for a 19 year old, or someone raising a family). Do not think for individual pilots money has to be a deciding issue. After training (expensive, no way around that) full weekend of XC using club equipment (no individual investment) is about $150 for 2 4-hours flights (8hrs total), tug tows included.

Dave: you write "Why must every glider pilot be forced to become a cross country soaring and racing pilot?". This is exactly what my wife (400+hrs) was saying when asked to participate in competitions. But when she took part in her first KSS camp she got hooked. Hooked into the camp concept, not competitions. These camps are not (ostensibly) to train ratrace racers, they are to enjoy soaring. You may soar above airfield all the camp time (some people do), but you still are in the group of fellow enthusiast (well, you are still expected to drive to the boonies to get them out often :-) ). You are not frown down for doing it in any way which gives YOU fun. The KSS motto is "Soar! Nothing else matters!" - and it is being lived. XC training is a means to the end.

But even if you think XC is not for you, or not for you yet, befriending a national-level competition pilot who will discuss with you, as an equal, some details of your or his thermalling is something which really does increase the fun factor overall. And you do this in a group. And you feel you belong, whatever your hours. This is (among other things) what these camps are about. I repeat - one thing these camps do is to integrate, to make evident there are no barriers.

I think also that "fun" is greatly increased if you get your technique better.
For one thing, you will be able to fly on days which beforehand you would skip. And these camps help a lot with technique at any level.

Last, I think the reference to Great Depression (Bill) is quite relevant. What matters mostly is in our heads and hands.

Piotr Szafranski




Remember, soaring began in the US during the Great Depression. All we need is a few thousand new people - and they are out there waiting to be found. I think the problem is entirely our own pessimism.

This post should come across as inspirational to all of us interested in
the subject it addresses. Strangely after two days there have been
no responses. I guess we could all be on vacation or flying contests, or even
buried in work but I considered we may not be able to understand the post because it is in Polish:-).

Considering this is a success story I thought a translation might enhance our understanding and spark some enthusiasm.





On Monday, August 18, 2014 5:15:57 AM UTC-4, wrote:

Hi, I am writing on behalf of Polish KSS (Karkonosze Soaring Society), a non-profit
organization of seasoned pilots, who believe, that teaching less experienced in
an orderly way brings more fruits that letting them alone to discover rules of
soaring the way, Lilienthal did. Time consuming, frustrating and at the end, non-efficient.
Karkonosze is the chain of mountains on Polish-Czech border, where unique thermal
and wave conditions permit for nearly year-round soaring activity.
We have been watching this thread as it contains many elements
relevant to all national soaring communities.

TRANSLATION:
Leadership characterized by organized training to a national standard is far superior to students going it alone at their own pace. We think you are experiencing the same problems we and others are attempting to overcome.





In short, the Polish soaring community believes that the model of our
(KSS) activity had substantially invigorated gliding scene in Poland,
with all subsequent benefits (increased participation, publicity,
training, increased flight hours within community etc). All this had
been done without interference with the existing structures and
without substantial monetary investment, basically by using existing
potential and underutilized resources. This is why we post in this
thread.



TRANSLATION:
The strategy we have pursued has been successful. The results include increased participation, publicity, training, increased flight hours for participants. You may wish to try it yourself.



Gliding in Poland is (roughly) based on local Aero Clubs
(self-financing) associated in central Polish Aero Club (minimal state
donations, majority financing by associate clubs) and two nationwide
gliding schools (plains and mountain) financed from within that
community. Financial situation is probably similar to what is in the
US, with differences in income levels in Poland vs US at one side and
legacy of cheap, usually exclusive leases on big grass airfields at
the other side.


TRANSLATION:
Apart from two national soaring sites our situation is not that different from yours.





First two stages of training are standardized nationwide (in the
main). Training is still based on old wooden ships (SZD-9, SZD-30)
with some glass whenever possible or necessary (aerobatics). Much
depends on how financially savvy a given club is. Some clubs gather
large fleets of cheap ($3k) SZD-30, some clubs go for more expensive
and less numerous glass. Clubs have usually several SZD-48s, which go
for "high performance" here. Ships build after 1990 are rare (unless
privately owned by club members or at national center school).



TRANSLATION:
You don't need fancy aeroplanes and infrastructure it will work with your current resources.



Training works well locally at the basic level (till first 10 solos).
It is usually organized in groups (10 is typical, but 40 may happen)
and for short intense periods - about 6 flying days whole, contiguous
if possible. This can be done as weather impact is moderate (training
is circuit patterns around sunset and sunrise, short small showers and/or
low - 1200' - cloudbase are tolerated). Clubs mostly have cheap local
accommodations (campsites and showers, dormitories, diner type bars).



TRANSLATION:
Organized group ab-initio training that takes place over a short intense contiguous period works best. Weather and soaring conditions do not have to be perfect and high altitude launches are not necessary for ab-initio training. Contiguous training does not necessarily mean contiguous days, contiguous weekends accomplishes the same as long as the training is organized in a
course type format where students and instructors commit to be present for
the duration of the training course regardless of weather and soaring conditions.




The problems start after solo for reasons discussed in this thread. At
any given time, at each airfield there are few people for further
training. Due to naturally smaller group being interested, weather
uncertainties (thermals needed!) etc. This leads to inefficiencies and
for some, disillusions. This is even more problem at XC training
level. In reality, people after license are left to themselves.

TRANSLATION:
We experience the same problem of providing advanced training as you do.



Here is where the concept introduced by KSS seem to change things. KSS
is just an animator group, with minimal resources (couple of gliders).
What we do is we organize, throughout the year, a week or 2 weeks long
training camps based at various airfields, in Poland and abroad. Camps
are usually targeted at XC training level, but many are accessible for
student-pilots (after solo, before license). The elements a
- use the infrastructure of some local club, augmented for the event (towplanes)
- use local club gliders but ask all participants to bring ships from
their clubs if possible
- invite (volunteer) instructors from all over the country, in
addition to local folks.
- make sure several people with considerable competition experience
are present and participate very actively

Typical attendance is 30-40 plus about 5 instructors. Usually there is
someone with world level competition experience, multiple people with
national level competition experience. The day is organized in a way
typical for competition (task setting, debriefings, meteo, log
analysis etc). Every day there is some gliding-related lecture,
usually very interactive and centered on XC performance.
Because of instructors and doubleseaters available, there is much of
intensive training, and students may fly tasks they could otherwise
only hear about (e.g. wave).

Because of the group character of the event, there is no problem with
retrieves (well, some pretty long and late night if 70% of pilots land
out :-) )



TRANSLATION:
We pool our resources and avoid wasteful one on one training and organize
group training using the resources of multiple locations. The larger group
dynamic overcomes the traditional problems associated with small groups or
one on one training in multiple locations. We have been able to accomplish
as a group what individual clubs were unable to do.



The fascinating thing is that this worked out with no changes to
existing organisation and no substantial money expenditure.



TRANSLATION:
We have been successful despite no new equipment or infrastructure.



Admittedly, there is a lot of "sweat equity" put in by the whole FI
community (vacation time etc). It turned out that there is MUCH unused
capacity in many clubs (even at national gliding schools), much good
will and volunteer time at all the local clubs we work with, and much
pent-up demand nationwide (we have people come from as far as
Australia as well). Somehow at most local clubs there were at any
given time 1-2 people who wanted to participate in some form of group
training, and could not have this locally. The lists for the camps
close within hours or days, there is always a waiting list. The
benefits of large regular gatherings are obvious in many aspects.



TRANSLATION:
Nothing is for free but you can probably access the same type of volunteers
we have been successful in engaging.



Each camp is open (and aimed at) to people who would before not
participate in regular competition events, for various reasons. This
really brings down some barriers. But in practice, maybe quarter of
pilots are quite hard-core.


TRANSLATION:
We have been able to engage a group that individual clubs had difficulty
reaching.



What is important is that local clubs support this idea (ship rental
to their members for the event for example). There is even a feedback
- some clubs organize similar things locally - people who participated
in KSS events got enthusiastic enough to mimic them, on a smaller
scale perhaps.



TRANSLATION:
Clubs that embrace this strategy often enhance the benefits by
adding further programs.



We would invite you to talk with us about details, and/or come to our
camps (in 2015 we can accept more participants)
to get the feel if this type of activity could be some element
of the US scene as well. For those who would want to come please
contact us early so the details (e.g. license validation) can be taken
care of at reasonable pace.



TRANSLATION:
We are willing to share our experiences with you and help you out.



KSS was involved also in some high-profile things (Sebastian Kawa flew in
Himalaya in the ship a KSS member provided, we broke through into national TV
coverage, some Worlds competitors from outside Poland are training
with us), but the real impact is for the community.


TRANSLATION:
Success could bring you publicity and further benefits.

Men no longer willing to put their amusement first is probably the biggest problem. Used to be daddy did what daddy wanted to do on the weekend and that was that. No longer works that way for almost all dads.
The other issue no one has mentioned is unpleasant club cultures. Not universal but there are plenty of them around. And the unpleasant culture may not be obvious to experienced pilots that own gliders and have a level of autonomy far removed from new students.
Solve those two and soaring will do just fine.

On Sunday, August 24, 2014 12:00:00 AM UTC-4, gb wrote:
Men no longer willing to put their amusement first ...

Earlier this summer, I helped an octogenarian wife put her octogenarian husband's trailer on her hitch to go retrieve him from a land out. It was interesting to see that 'the old ways' were not entirely made-up tales.

If XC soaring lasts long enough, we will someday be able to summon our self-driving cars and trailers to a landout.

Or just beam the glider home, Scottie!

Dan Marotta

On 8/24/2014 8:57 AM, son_of_flubber wrote:
On Sunday, August 24, 2014 12:00:00 AM UTC-4, gb wrote:
Men no longer willing to put their amusement first ...
Earlier this summer, I helped an octogenarian wife put her octogenarian husband's trailer on her hitch to go retrieve him from a land out. It was interesting to see that 'the old ways' were not entirely made-up tales.

If XC soaring lasts long enough, we will someday be able to summon our self-driving cars and trailers to a landout.

On Sunday, August 24, 2014 9:10:37 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
Or just beam the glider home, Scottie!

Dan Marotta
On 8/24/2014 8:57 AM, son_of_flubber wrote:



On Sunday, August 24, 2014 12:00:00 AM UTC-4, gb wrote:


Men no longer willing to put their amusement first ...


Earlier this summer, I helped an octogenarian wife put her octogenarian husband's trailer on her hitch to go retrieve him from a land out. It was interesting to see that 'the old ways' were not entirely made-up tales.

If XC soaring lasts long enough, we will someday be able to summon our self-driving cars and trailers to a landout.

or we'll all have jet sustainers and never land out again, everyone makes it home for beertime.

GK

I like the part about hot women..................where I fly they all work at the local coffee shop.

GK