US Rules change needed for devaluation of contest day

On Friday, August 22, 2014 2:05:36 PM UTC-4, Richard wrote:
On Thursday, August 21, 2014 10:12:09 PM UTC-7, Dave Leonard wrote:

Here's the Sports Class at Region 9 N rescored using worst day adjustment.

The plea for data is good, but the main point of the rule is not to reshuffle the podium at the end of the contest, but to change the experience of flying the contest. For that, we can't simulate or re-score, we need to try it.

That's why it's available, as an option, at regionals. The RC does its best to evaluate new ideas with available data. But then you have to go try it, collect some new data, and see if it works, where the bugs are and if people like it. (Last start rule is also there in the same way.)

Pilots who like the idea: Implore the CD / CM of your upcoming regional to declare worst day adjustment for your regional, and announce it before preferential entry deadline so that the pilot's meeting doesn't have to be a long contentious matter.

It is only fair to pilots who don't want to try it to let them know ahead of time.

John Cochrane

A lot of thought went into the design of this and some of the features are quite clever in terms of avoiding unintended consequences. Re-scoring of past contests is informative as far as it goes, but it doesn't answer any of the basic questions about how pilots might behave differently - the theories are all over the map in this regard. Having a trial at a regionals with some real pilot feedback on the experience and how it affected their contest strategy would answer many of the critical questions.

One purpose of regionals is to broaden the appeal of glider racing. Some feel that being knocked out of contention on a single, perhaps fluky day makes some pilots enjoy contests less while others argue that not everyone deserves a ribbon and fluky days are the real test of racing skill. These little innovations in the rules are attempts to address the first effect while not generating too much of the second effect. Finding the right balance also requires some real world trials.

9B

On Saturday, August 23, 2014 11:51:46 AM UTC-7, wrote:
A lot of thought went into the design of this and some of the features are quite clever in terms of avoiding unintended consequences. Re-scoring of past contests is informative as far as it goes, but it doesn't answer any of the basic questions about how pilots might behave differently - the theories are all over the map in this regard. Having a trial at a regionals with some real pilot feedback on the experience and how it affected their contest strategy would answer many of the critical questions.



One purpose of regionals is to broaden the appeal of glider racing. Some feel that being knocked out of contention on a single, perhaps fluky day makes some pilots enjoy contests less while others argue that not everyone deserves a ribbon and fluky days are the real test of racing skill. These little innovations in the rules are attempts to address the first effect while not generating too much of the second effect. Finding the right balance also requires some real world trials.



9B

Maybe some information would help.

What year was the rule adopted?
How many times has it been used in a regional contest?
Was the question asked on the Pilot Opinion Poll and if so the results?


Richard
www.craggyaero.com.

On Saturday, August 23, 2014 2:51:46 PM UTC-4, wrote:
A lot of thought went into the design of this and some of the features are quite clever in terms of avoiding unintended consequences. Re-scoring of past contests is informative as far as it goes, but it doesn't answer any of the basic questions about how pilots might behave differently - the theories are all over the map in this regard. Having a trial at a regionals with some real pilot feedback on the experience and how it affected their contest strategy would answer many of the critical questions.



One purpose of regionals is to broaden the appeal of glider racing. Some feel that being knocked out of contention on a single, perhaps fluky day makes some pilots enjoy contests less while others argue that not everyone deserves a ribbon and fluky days are the real test of racing skill. These little innovations in the rules are attempts to address the first effect while not generating too much of the second effect. Finding the right balance also requires some real world trials.



9B

If the goal is to broaden the appeal for entry level or "recreational" competition guys, how about making it a Sports Class thing?

-Evan Ludeman / T8

Dave,

Thank you for posting that rescore sheet.

Interesting to look at and speculate with it in hand.

That was a awesome soaring session we had in Nephi!

I look forward to more of those fantastic contests/ OLC events put on by Bruno Ron and Gene.

Nick

In sailing, most major events (and most small events for that matter) have as standard practice a "drop" race or "throw out" after a certain number of races are completed (usually 6). This is very standard in sailing. If you get in only 3 races (for example) in for the weekend, all races count because throwing one third of the available sores would greatly skew the results. But once you get a solid number of races, six, everyone throws the worst and only your best 5 count.

I love the idea of "throw-outs" (otherwise referred to as mulligans in sailing) in soaring but think the adjustment should only kick in after 3 solid contest days are completed (.25 * WDSD). Beginning to "tune scores" after only one or two flying days seems a bit early.

Sean

On Friday, 22 August 2014 09:03:49 UTC-6, Sean Fidler wrote:
In sailing, most major events (and most small events for that matter) have as standard practice a "drop" race or "throw out" after a certain number of races are completed (usually 6). This is very standard in sailing. If you get in only 3 races (for example) in for the weekend, all races count because throwing one third of the available sores would greatly skew the results. But once you get a solid number of races, six, everyone throws the worst and only your best 5 count.



I love the idea of "throw-outs" (otherwise referred to as mulligans in sailing) in soaring but think the adjustment should only kick in after 3 solid contest days are completed (.25 * WDSD). Beginning to "tune scores" after only one or two flying days seems a bit early.



Sean

The rule reads as follows

11.4.4 â€* Worst Day Score Adjustment
If this is declared to be in effect, an adjustment is calculated and added to the cumulative score of each entrant.
11.4.4.1 â€* Worst Day Score Differential
For each entrant, WDSD is the greatest difference on any contest day between the entrant's score (before application of a Contest penalty) and the highest score achieved by any regular entrant in the class on that day.
11.4.4.2 â€* A Worst Day Score Adjustment is added to each entrant's cumulative score, as follows:
After one official day: WDSA = zero
After 2 official days: WDSA = 0.25 * WDSD
After 3 official days: WDSA = 0.5 * WDSD
After 4 official days: WDSA = 0.75 * WDSD
After 5 or more official days: WDSA = WDSD

With little to no use of this rule there is no experience or history to try to make assessments of the validity. Maybe after 3 days is better than 2.

Would like to see it actually used before having lengthy discussions.

Ironically, I used this rule in Ionia (R6N) all 3 years I ran it. I might have been the first to use it actually. So I have some relevant experience with the rule and with the reaction competitors have had to it. Oddly, nobody has asked me about the experience at the SSA.

We advertised the rule usage and promoted it to potential competitors. People seemed to respond positively to the idea (many though it was the ability to throw out a worst day score) although I think it had more to do with locals being able to miss a day for work rather than having a bad flying day and therefore have no chance of scoring well in the contest.

Personally, disagree with the concept of throw outs in sailing or soaring. Especially soaring as we often have so few flying days constituting a competition. I think ALL races should count 100% in a competition. The most consistent pilot is the champion. Not the most consistent pilot with a mulligan. I'm commenting on the rule favorably only in terms regarding the "science experiment" of attracting more "competitors" by making the sport more forgiving via rules (wide radius TAT tasks, worst day score adjustment, etc).

I like the idea of having more competitors but rules like this, compromises in task quality (TAT, MAT) also negatively impact the overall competition quality. We need to be careful that we do not "water the sport down" so much that the people who actually care about serious competition are left disenchanted.

Sean

"Oddly, nobody has asked me about the experience at the SSA. "

Actually the ssa rules committee (me) talked to you a lot and to other pilots, and discussed lessons learned at the meeting, reflected in the minutes

John cochrane