How do we inspire pilots to truly take up cross country soaring ?

If numbers are increasing then why on earth would you train in 2-33's? Hell, I don't know why you do it NOW -- most of the rest of the world has been training in glass for several decades.

In a lot of the world, including clubs in NZ, numbers are static or declining. This means that the fixed costs per head are increasing; a big lump of that is insurance and maintenance. Clubs with older non-glass gliders (i.e. Puchatek, ASK13, Ka7, 2-33) have much lower insurance costs and the gliders are (relatively) cheap to repair. This keeps the smaller clubs in the black - THAT's why clubs keep training in older gliders.

The difficulty with this is that, at some point, the student will need to progress into something with "longer legs" or they'll just get bored. Most students don't mind doing the hard yards of basic training IF they can see a series of stepping stones to going cross-country.

Often the thing that forces clubs to move to glass (or fold) isn't the L/D of their trainers, it's the increasing rarity of people who are qualified to inspect and repair wood, metal and fabric. Oh, and the limited lifetime of glue.

DH

On Tuesday, September 8, 2015 at 3:39:08 AM UTC+3, David Hirst wrote:
If numbers are increasing then why on earth would you train in 2-33's? Hell, I don't know why you do it NOW -- most of the rest of the world has been training in glass for several decades.

In a lot of the world, including clubs in NZ, numbers are static or declining. This means that the fixed costs per head are increasing; a big lump of that is insurance and maintenance. Clubs with older non-glass gliders (i.e. Puchatek, ASK13, Ka7, 2-33) have much lower insurance costs and the gliders are (relatively) cheap to repair. This keeps the smaller clubs in the black - THAT's why clubs keep training in older gliders.

Looking at the annual accounts, insurance on the DG1000s isn't even close to being a major factor.

It's the tow plane that eats all the money. And next is the rent for the land our clubhouse and hangars sit on and the landing fees and control tower fees. Those are 10x bigger than the glider insurance.

We're in the process of moving to an airfield we'll own ourselves -- or at least have a 99 year lease on -- with 2 km of space to play in. And we're getting a brand new european winch. That and new buildings are costing a bit up front, but hopefully will reduce the costs in future.

Where are you?

On 9/8/2015 1:09 AM, Bruce Hoult wrote:
On Tuesday, September 8, 2015 at 3:39:08 AM UTC+3, David Hirst wrote:
If numbers are increasing then why on earth would you train in 2-33's? Hell, I don't know why you do it NOW -- most of the rest of the world has been training in glass for several decades.
In a lot of the world, including clubs in NZ, numbers are static or declining. This means that the fixed costs per head are increasing; a big lump of that is insurance and maintenance. Clubs with older non-glass gliders (i.e. Puchatek, ASK13, Ka7, 2-33) have much lower insurance costs and the gliders are (relatively) cheap to repair. This keeps the smaller clubs in the black - THAT's why clubs keep training in older gliders.
Looking at the annual accounts, insurance on the DG1000s isn't even close to being a major factor.

It's the tow plane that eats all the money. And next is the rent for the land our clubhouse and hangars sit on and the landing fees and control tower fees. Those are 10x bigger than the glider insurance.

We're in the process of moving to an airfield we'll own ourselves -- or at least have a 99 year lease on -- with 2 km of space to play in. And we're getting a brand new european winch. That and new buildings are costing a bit up front, but hopefully will reduce the costs in future.

On Friday, September 4, 2015 at 7:47:46 AM UTC-4, wrote:
I don't think soaring needs to grow much. We don't need, and don't have the capacity for lots of pilots. What we need are a handful of obsessed pilots. Obsessed soaring pilots make the wheel go round. Said this before the big recruitment hurdle is cultural, men no longer command their recreational time. Pool to chose from is never married chaps with no girlfriend or kids or old guys with grown kids.

i don't agree with the last two sentences at all. our club has several family guys who take up soaring. a family woman too... and guess what, her KIDS started flying too. so i vehemently disagree. i'm going to get married next year, and i'll have kids too. does that mean i have to quit flying? i dont think so. i recognize that i'm someone who already is engrossed before family and marriage, but my partner in our ASW 20 learned to fly with two kids in highschool, and is happily married. i think your perception of our pool to draw from is incredibly black and white, and inaccurate as well.