The highly successful UK Junior XC program vs. USA's nonexistantJunior XC program. Why?

Let me suggest that you take a longer term approach to a Junior Nationals like a 5 year or 10 year time frame. Even though our club has 35 Juniors, there's just one I know of that could participate in a Junior Nationals this year. If he's busy during that time, we'd send zero. I suspect other clubs would be in the same boat.

Why don't you consider a Junior XC soaring event as a way to prime the pump for a nationals that follow a year or two later? For example, every two years, we take our Juniors to Mifflin -any skill level, and bring several gliders and instructors. We fly 2-33's, 1-26's ASK-21's and Duo Discus and our Discus CS. We camp on the airport for several days and give the kids a chance to fly at a different airport, experience XC ridge soaring and so on.. They absolutely love it.

You could do the same. Arrange to have several XC instructors and aircraft come to a location (perhaps an East and a West event would be best due to distance). The intent of the session should be to stimulate interest in cross country flying for Juniors of varying skill levels. You can bracket the kids and have a few fly competitively while others learn XC. Start small, limit attendance -perhaps to those who have soloed or have a private pilot certificate and see how it goes. Do something crazy like vette them online using Condor ahead of time.

Keep in mind that whatever you do, it needs to be a parent friendly event. Younger Juniors don't have transportation and for those who do, today's parents aren't going to hand them the keys to SUV with a glider on the back and wave goodbye as they head cross country for the event. Kids are far more controlled and protected than you and I were at their age and even at age 18 and older. Giving parents a chance to help out or do something with their kids while there and making it a turnkey event with gliders to fly and instructors to help out will be important.

A year or two of an event like that should give you a much better idea of how to stimulate Junior XC interests.

Thanks for your comment.

For me, it's all about what the juniors want. If 10 are willing to show up, I'll host them to the absolute best of my ability and will help them in any way I possibly can. I am open to their guidance and input for sure. If they want another location or a different date, cool.

Skill level, at this point, is unimportant. We know that many clubs will have to work hard to develop our junior pilots to XC levels. Half of our clubs don't have XC for their adults (club equipment)! We have clear models to follow with Jr. XC soaring, however. If your juniors don't have the skills yet to fly solo, then bring a two place (or rent of borrow one) and help them fly with an instructor or coach. I have challenged ALL US clubs to make the effort. I am confident that many can meet the challenge. Its a matter of focus, will and perseverance. Falling short is part of learning. There is little to loose here in being aggressive and trying to schedule an event. If in a country of 340 million, we can't get 10 juniors to a contest (when Britain (66 Million) gets 70, has dozens of events throughout the year, many with waiting lists, etc) we should be truly ashamed.

As these other countries have clearly shown, juniors truly appreciate having "their own" event. In my opinion, they can shape it however they want it.. I look to the Jr. leaders to help make decisions on all of this along with guidance from adult leaders.

The big question is how long will it take for US clubs to make the serious changes required to "truly support" junior XC soaring and build a culture that is as focused on developing juniors as it is on satisfying seniors. If you think about it, any soaring nation that is not equal in these two measures is failing. Therefore, the USA is not doing to well....hmm. "How long" is the big challenge standing in the way of building Junior XC soaring in the USA. I just don't care about the typical excuses anymore. Send your kids! Get them fired up.

I am sure this endeavor will be a learning process, but the upside of having a US Jr. Nationals next year (2016) is well worth the effort. For me at least.

We should fly a representative over to speak at the upcoming SSA convention.. We would be crazy not to do this in fact. WHO IS AT THE HELM OF US SOARING AND THE SSA AGAIN?

Sean

To be clear, we should fly over a "British Gliding Association"(BGA) representative who is intimate with their Junior Development Program to the upcoming SSA convention. He/She/They should be presenting on Day 1 at 9am and the session should be standing room only...

What they are doing in Britain should be carefully studied by all of us.

What is a higher priority?

Sean
7T

It's been a long time since I was a junior (I'm 64, having started flying at 14), but I'm not sure how appealing a small Junior Nationals would have been for me at the time. One of the most thrilling experiences of my early soaring career was my first contest when I was 17: the Central Ohio Soaring Association's Annual Fall Roundup one weekend in September 1968. My father brought his Diamant HBV and we also trailered our 1-26. One of the attractions was flying with the "big boys": e.g., AJ Smith, Rudy Mozer, and other fine pilots I'd known about for years.

An even bigger thrill was my first nationals, the 1976 15M Nats in Bryan, OH (the first 15M contest), in which I flew our Libelle 201. I'm not sure whether there were other juniors at the 1968 contest but I know of at least one other at the 1976 Nats: Eric Mozer (he was 22 then but I was actually 25). True, by that time I had flown enough regionals to feel comfortable tilting with the top pilots but I measured myself against Eric's performance each day there not particularly because he was a junior, but because by then he was already winning days and on his way to winning his first nationals not long after. And, of course, a young Tommy Beltz was already on his way at that point, as well.

Going to a juniors contest might have been fun, but more because of the social aspects, the mutual support, and what I could hopefully learn. In its proposed form at Ionia--i.e., acknowledging that most of those participating will likely be fairly new to competition--I think I would have viewed a junior nats almost as a camp, not a real contest.

That's not to say there's anything wrong with that concept, only that others have proposed modifications to the idea that would enhance its value as a camp: e.g., dual instruction in high-performance two-seaters from experienced pilots, classroom sessions, detailed debriefs.

Like Sean, some of the best experiences of my life have been in soaring. I was extremely fortunate that my father was an instructor, competition pilot, glider owner, and strong supporter of my flying, and that we lived near what is now the Caesar Creek Soaring Club, surely one of the country's most vibrant soaring organizations. I've also been fortunate to visit or fly with Harris Hill Soaring Club, Valley Soaring, and the Blairstown folks, three of the strongest groups for juniors. I don't have any new answers as to how to encourage more junior participation in cross country and contests. I do know I would have given almost anything to be able to ride around in the back seat with someone like Karl Striedieck on a contest task back then. Heck, I still would, but that would mean giving up a day in one of the few contests I can fly now.

Good luck with the proposed Junior Nats. If you've already received feedback from a good cross section of junior pilots and this is the result, just ignore my dated response. If not, it would probably be worth surveying the juniors we already have to see what they would like in a dedicated contest, event, or sub-class in a larger contest. As with any other "minority", it's dangerous to presume that we older white males have any insight into what others really want.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"
U.S.A.

Good stuff Chip! I agree.

Where is the SSA on this topic?

Crickets.........

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 5:40:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:
Let me suggest that you take a longer term approach to a Junior Nationals like a 5 year or 10 year time frame. Even though our club has 35 Juniors, there's just one I know of that could participate in a Junior Nationals this year. If he's busy during that time, we'd send zero. I suspect other clubs would be in the same boat.

Why don't you consider a Junior XC soaring event as a way to prime the pump for a nationals that follow a year or two later? For example, every two years, we take our Juniors to Mifflin -any skill level, and bring several gliders and instructors. We fly 2-33's, 1-26's ASK-21's and Duo Discus and our Discus CS. We camp on the airport for several days and give the kids a chance to fly at a different airport, experience XC ridge soaring and so on. They absolutely love it.

You could do the same. Arrange to have several XC instructors and aircraft come to a location (perhaps an East and a West event would be best due to distance). The intent of the session should be to stimulate interest in cross country flying for Juniors of varying skill levels. You can bracket the kids and have a few fly competitively while others learn XC. Start small, limit attendance -perhaps to those who have soloed or have a private pilot certificate and see how it goes. Do something crazy like vette them online using Condor ahead of time.

Keep in mind that whatever you do, it needs to be a parent friendly event.. Younger Juniors don't have transportation and for those who do, today's parents aren't going to hand them the keys to SUV with a glider on the back and wave goodbye as they head cross country for the event. Kids are far more controlled and protected than you and I were at their age and even at age 18 and older. Giving parents a chance to help out or do something with their kids while there and making it a turnkey event with gliders to fly and instructors to help out will be important.

A year or two of an event like that should give you a much better idea of how to stimulate Junior XC interests.

We're beginning to lay the ground work for 2016 in R2/R3. Since R2N at Wurtsboro will be replaced by the Club Nationals our common venue for newbie 2 seat flying will need to move for 2016.
I'm sure Dansville will be stepping up with R3 in August. I'm planning on bringing K21 with my 2 hottest juniors from '14, and maybe one more. I hear P3 is looking at bringing Ethan and the Grob. Hopefully we can get Harris Hill to bring a 21 or 2 with some juniors. I'ts only 50 miles away. Dansville has a '21 and some live juniors.
We should be able to get enough for a Bus Class.
If we do a bit of organizing, I expect we could have 10-12 newbies at that event, most of them Juniors.
This is pretty much like what we have been doing, but by making it closer to Elmira maybe we can suck them in.
UH
UH

At 21:22 06 October 2015, wrote:
On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 5:40:06 PM UTC-4,
wr=
ote:
Let me suggest that you take a longer term approach to a Junior
Nationals=
like a 5 year or 10 year time frame. Even though our club has 35
Juniors,=
there's just one I know of that could participate in a Junior Nationals
th=
is year. If he's busy during that time, we'd send zero. I suspect other
c=
lubs would be in the same boat.
=20
Why don't you consider a Junior XC soaring event as a way to prime the
pu=
mp for a nationals that follow a year or two later? For example, every
two=
years, we take our Juniors to Mifflin -any skill level, and bring
several
=
gliders and instructors. We fly 2-33's, 1-26's ASK-21's and Duo Discus
and=
our Discus CS. We camp on the airport for several days and give the
kids
=
a chance to fly at a different airport, experience XC ridge soaring and
so
=
on. They absolutely love it.
=20
You could do the same. Arrange to have several XC instructors and
aircra=
ft come to a location (perhaps an East and a West event would be best due
t=
o distance). The intent of the session should be to stimulate interest
in
=
cross country flying for Juniors of varying skill levels. You can
bracket
=
the kids and have a few fly competitively while others learn XC. Start
smal=
l, limit attendance -perhaps to those who have soloed or have a private
pil=
ot certificate and see how it goes. Do something crazy like vette them
onl=
ine using Condor ahead of time.
=20
Keep in mind that whatever you do, it needs to be a parent friendly
event=
.. Younger Juniors don't have transportation and for those who do,
today's
=
parents aren't going to hand them the keys to SUV with a glider on the
back=
and wave goodbye as they head cross country for the event. Kids are far
m=
ore controlled and protected than you and I were at their age and even at
a=
ge 18 and older. Giving parents a chance to help out or do something
with
=
their kids while there and making it a turnkey event with gliders to fly
an=
d instructors to help out will be important.
=20
A year or two of an event like that should give you a much better idea
of=
how to stimulate Junior XC interests.

We're beginning to lay the ground work for 2016 in R2/R3. Since R2N at
Wurt=
sboro will be replaced by the Club Nationals our common venue for newbie
2
=
seat flying will need to move for 2016.
I'm sure Dansville will be stepping up with R3 in August. I'm planning on
b=
ringing K21 with my 2 hottest juniors from '14, and maybe one more. I
hear
=
P3 is looking at bringing Ethan and the Grob. Hopefully we can get Harris
H=
ill to bring a 21 or 2 with some juniors. I'ts only 50 miles away.
Dansvill=
e has a '21 and some live juniors.=20
We should be able to get enough for a Bus Class.
If we do a bit of organizing, I expect we could have 10-12 newbies at
that
=
event, most of them Juniors.=20
This is pretty much like what we have been doing, but by making it closer
t=
o Elmira maybe we can suck them in.
UH
UH
The junior comments

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Huge thanks to Sutton Bank for hosting the latest round of the Winter
Series. A very warm welcome, friendly club members and a stunning view
from the top of the ridge!!!

Despite the pretty average weather forecast around 60 Juniors plus
another
20 more senior pilots headed to YGC for the weekend.

A mixture of ridge/wave followed with 75 aerotows across the weekend and
a
pretty hefty bar bill as well!

Thank you to those that dragged 2 seaters up to help us out. As ever, we
cannot do it without you!

We will return to the Long Mynd in early February. If anyone is
interested
in bringing a 2 seater along please let us know.

Cheers

UK Junior Gliding Development Team

Meanwhile in the USA?..............

Dude - lead, follow or get out of the way. Whining is counter-productive - it sucks energy out of everyone who's put actual effort into doing something, as well as those who might.

Talk is cheap - on the 'net it's really cheap.

9B

*opens fridge...yep, same food as when i looked five minutes ago....*