Affect of Alcohol (Beer) on Soaring and Soaring Racing

On Thursday, February 21, 2019 at 3:34:30 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Thursday, February 21, 2019 at 5:32:51 AM UTC+13, Papa3 wrote:
snip

For the hangover condition, they flew 14 hours after drinking enough ethanol mixed with diet soft drinks to attain a blood alcohol concentration of 100 mg/dl.

A questionable study, if in fact the ethanol was "mixed with diet soft drinks" that contained aspartame (a confounding variable). Aspartame, according to retired food scientist Dr Woodrow Monte (a former neighbor of mine in the South Island), is the most dangerous food additive on the market today. It changes the ratio of amino acids in the blood, blocking or lowering the levels of serotonin, tyrosine, dopamine, norepinephrine, and adrenaline.. Even though it is touted as natural, it has a synthetic methyl group on one of the amino acids that rapidly breaks down to methanol (wood alcohol). According to Dr Monte, methyl alcohol is metabolized differently in the human body compared to other animals, and is far more toxic in humans, which is why studies have trouble nailing down the hazards related to aspartame, because most rely on animal, not human studies. Methyl alcohol, after it is taken up by the body as a "Trojan horse" into susceptible tissues such as the brain, converts rapidly into formaldehyde, causing serious damage to proteins and DNA.

Fresh fruits and veggies contain minute amounts of methanol, but there's a natural mechanism that makes it harmless. Pectin firmly binds to methanol, allowing it to simply pass through your body and be excreted, because the human body does not have the enzymes to break that bond. If you or anyone you know drinks diet sodas (or uses NutraSweet, Equal, Spoonful, Equal-Measure), then have him or her look at Woody's website -- WhileScienceSleeps dot com. Or get a copy of his book, as I did -- While Science Sleeps, a Sweetener Kills.

And, for the record (being as I am P7 SCUM), Gary quaffs more of his own brew on both contest days and rest days than does any other competitor. Perhaps there's a *secret ingredient* in Papa 7 Brewery kegs that confers a competitive advantage.

Yet another aspartame hoax:

https://web.archive.org/web/20130505...health-hoax-2/

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart...ews-180961880/

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/as...-sweet-poison/

2G wrote on 2/24/2019 7:53 PM:

On Thursday, February 21, 2019 at 3:34:30 PM UTC-8, wrote:

On Thursday, February 21, 2019 at 5:32:51 AM UTC+13, Papa3 wrote:

snip



For the hangover condition, they flew 14 hours after drinking enough ethanol mixed with diet soft drinks to attain a blood alcohol concentration of 100 mg/dl.


A questionable study, if in fact the ethanol was "mixed with diet soft drinks" that contained aspartame (a confounding variable). Aspartame, according to retired food scientist Dr Woodrow Monte (a former neighbor of mine in the South Island), is the most dangerous food additive on the market today. It changes the ratio of amino acids in the blood, blocking or lowering the levels of serotonin, tyrosine, dopamine, norepinephrine, and adrenaline.. Even though it is touted as natural, it has a synthetic methyl group on one of the amino acids that rapidly breaks down to methanol (wood alcohol). According to Dr Monte, methyl alcohol is metabolized differently in the human body compared to other animals, and is far more toxic in humans, which is why studies have trouble nailing down the hazards related to aspartame, because most rely on animal, not human studies. Methyl alcohol, after it is taken up by the body as a "Trojan horse" into susceptible tissues such as the brain, converts rapidly into formaldehyde, causing serious damage to proteins and DNA.

Fresh fruits and veggies contain minute amounts of methanol, but there's a natural mechanism that makes it harmless. Pectin firmly binds to methanol, allowing it to simply pass through your body and be excreted, because the human body does not have the enzymes to break that bond. If you or anyone you know drinks diet sodas (or uses NutraSweet, Equal, Spoonful, Equal-Measure), then have him or her look at Woody's website -- WhileScienceSleeps dot com. Or get a copy of his book, as I did -- While Science Sleeps, a Sweetener Kills.

And, for the record (being as I am P7 SCUM), Gary quaffs more of his own brew on both contest days and rest days than does any other competitor. Perhaps there's a *secret ingredient* in Papa 7 Brewery kegs that confers a competitive advantage.


Yet another aspartame hoax:

https://web.archive.org/web/20130505...health-hoax-2/

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart...ews-180961880/

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/as...-sweet-poison/


There are scientific studies showing more than two diet drinks a day are linked to
some health issues, including strokes. This new article by Consumer Reports covers
some them:

https://www.consumerreports.org/suga...223_nsltr_food




--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Dec 2014a" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm

http://soaringsafety.org/prevention/...anes-2014A.pdf

On Monday, February 25, 2019 at 4:53:42 PM UTC+13, 2G wrote:
On Thursday, February 21, 2019 at 3:34:30 PM UTC-8, wrote:
On Thursday, February 21, 2019 at 5:32:51 AM UTC+13, Papa3 wrote:
snip

For the hangover condition, they flew 14 hours after drinking enough ethanol mixed with diet soft drinks to attain a blood alcohol concentration of 100 mg/dl.

A questionable study, if in fact the ethanol was "mixed with diet soft drinks" that contained aspartame (a confounding variable). Aspartame, according to retired food scientist Dr Woodrow Monte (a former neighbor of mine in the South Island), is the most dangerous food additive on the market today. It changes the ratio of amino acids in the blood, blocking or lowering the levels of serotonin, tyrosine, dopamine, norepinephrine, and adrenaline. Even though it is touted as natural, it has a synthetic methyl group on one of the amino acids that rapidly breaks down to methanol (wood alcohol). According to Dr Monte, methyl alcohol is metabolized differently in the human body compared to other animals, and is far more toxic in humans, which is why studies have trouble nailing down the hazards related to aspartame, because most rely on animal, not human studies. Methyl alcohol, after it is taken up by the body as a "Trojan horse" into susceptible tissues such as the brain, converts rapidly into formaldehyde, causing serious damage to proteins and DNA.

Fresh fruits and veggies contain minute amounts of methanol, but there's a natural mechanism that makes it harmless. Pectin firmly binds to methanol, allowing it to simply pass through your body and be excreted, because the human body does not have the enzymes to break that bond. If you or anyone you know drinks diet sodas (or uses NutraSweet, Equal, Spoonful, Equal-Measure), then have him or her look at Woody's website -- WhileScienceSleeps dot com. Or get a copy of his book, as I did -- While Science Sleeps, a Sweetener Kills.


Yet another aspartame hoax:

https://web.archive.org/web/20130505...health-hoax-2/

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart...ews-180961880/

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/as...-sweet-poison/

Reply to 2G:

You're joking, right? You cite Snopes as a reputable fact-checker? LOL. And you cite the ACSH (American Council on Science and Health)? What do you know about the ACSH? Who started it and who funds it, eh? It has been funded from the get-go by big agri-business and trade groups such as Kellogg, General Mills, PepsiCo, and the American Beverage Association, among others. That's open source. The entire concept of ACSH was commissioned by Pfizer in response to the 1958 Food Additive Amendment, which restricted the use of cancer-causing chemicals in food. Propaganda is very effective in protecting corporations' profits.

The ACSH has been active in downplaying the risks from DDT, dioxin, asbestos, and other polluting chemicals. Shortly after ACSH's founding, it abandoned even the appearance of independent funding. In a 1997 interview, the ACSH's founder explained that she might as well take industry money without restrictions, as ACSH was already being touted as a "paid liar for industry". It's a good-paying gig, if you can get it.

During its first 15 years of operation, ACSH published the names of its institutional funders, but it has stopped doing this, making it harder to identify where all of its money comes from. As consumer advocate Ralph Nader wrote: "ACSH is a consumer front organization for its business backers. It has seized the language and style of the existing consumer organizations, but its real purpose, you might say, is to glove the hand that feeds it."

Those big pharma, agri and chemical companies are getting good bang for their propagandistic buck when people like you cite them as a definitive source to convince consumers to ignore independent scientists' findings and warnings and instead treat them as a "hoax". A dude named Gilbert Ross was acting prez and exec director of ACSH as of 2015. His medical license was revoked for professional misconduct in 1995 after it was revealed that he had been involved in a scheme that defrauded the New York State Medicaid system of $8 million. He was sentenced to 46 months in federal prison and didn't regain his med license until 2004. But, hey, that's good enough for the corporations that fund ACSH. He's their kinda guy! And you can imagine just how much money is being made by the sale of aspartame. Those profit margins are huge and well worth protecting, right?

If you read Dr Woodrow Monte's book _While Science Sleeps, a Sweetener Kills_, you'll see to what lengths these corporations will go to silence or even incapacitate independent scientists (who have nothing to gain from their whistle-blowing, but everything to lose, including their lives). Read. The. Book. Dr Monte is the worldwide expert on aspartame, and it has cost him plenty to take on the powerful corporations and try to warn the public. I admire his courage. He's published his findings on his website and has given plenty of interviews (YouTube), too, so it's free to the public. And then come back to RAS and set me straight, 2G.

On 2/20/2019 9:07 AM, wrote:
Thanks....
Snip...

Your comment on R.A.S. - point taken - I am OK with a tad of Humor....
often a good thing LOL - but I do think it is a interesting subject -

Does anyone else remember the "study" of the laid-back DJ on "WKRP in
Cincinnati" involving alcohol/reflexes-over-time? Woo hoo!!!

Bob - your reflexes may vary - W.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On Wednesday, February 20, 2019 at 9:14:11 AM UTC-5, danlj wrote:
Well, ask a serious question on r.a.s., and see whether you get any serious answers.... We could start keeping score.

Seriously, when researching material in 2018 for my SSA talk, "29 Ways to Make Yourself Stupid," I discovered two interesting factoids:

1: Most studies of alcohol-related performance study things like, Can he still walk and chew gum after 12 beers?
But I found one study of the effect on alcohol on *complex cognitive performance.* This study found that a single ounce of alcohol produced a measurable loss.
Frankly, most flying does not entail complex cognitive skill any more than does riding a bicycle -- but contest flying in primarily cognitive, the flying skill a given,.

2: Late effects of alcohol. I found only 2 studies asking how long the impairment lasts after drinking.
This is important because alcohol is metabolized to aldehyde (think:formaldehyde). Alcohol has a half-life of about 2 hours; aldehyde has a half-live of about 6 hours.
Both studies brought subjects' blood alcohol levels to 0.10mg% (the legal limit in many places), then retested their performance repeatedly over time. In both studies, impaired performance was still significant at the end of the observation period: 24 hours in one and 48 hours in the other.

My take from this is that if you get drunk, you are still impaired on Day 3, and we have *no* data showing when you may actually return to normal.

I am sure that many competitors have done their own experiments, and would explain why elite athletes often defer alcohol to the end of the season or campaign.

With activities that produce anxiety, alcohol may improve performance by decreasing anxiety. But there are safer drugs for that (none of which are recommended by aviation medical experts).

On Tuesday, February 19, 2019 at 2:39:11 PM UTC-6, wrote:

It actually was a serious question - I just watched Free Solo - a guy focused on a extremely technical sport. Doesn't drink.

I also have been around several people with Olympic medals - it varies but most only drink at the very end of the competition season - for the reasons of better rest/recovery, focus and no desire to relax.

I have seen a few Kawa interviews and heard him say "If I see a competitor go for a beer, I know I can beat them" - I believe he thought it was more physiological.

I live in an area with a very nice Yacht Club - has 2 huge Bars and porch to drink on over looking Jamaica Bay, in a Extremely Irish community - the only thing missing are boats. Belle Harbor Yacht Club! no one ever get sea sick.

WH

Sex, drugs, rock and roll, and then let's go fly! :-D

Seriously, a lot of this trends towards excessive drinking, not a beer
after flying.Â* And most of us are not world class contest fliers.Â*
Anyone who wants to abstain from alcohol has my blessing. Anyone who
wants to take a single end of day beer from me can go pound sand (or
something more colorful).

On 2/20/2019 7:14 AM, danlj wrote:
Well, ask a serious question on r.a.s., and see whether you get any serious answers.... We could start keeping score.

Seriously, when researching material in 2018 for my SSA talk, "29 Ways to Make Yourself Stupid," I discovered two interesting factoids:

1: Most studies of alcohol-related performance study things like, Can he still walk and chew gum after 12 beers?
But I found one study of the effect on alcohol on *complex cognitive performance.* This study found that a single ounce of alcohol produced a measurable loss.
Frankly, most flying does not entail complex cognitive skill any more than does riding a bicycle -- but contest flying in primarily cognitive, the flying skill a given,.

2: Late effects of alcohol. I found only 2 studies asking how long the impairment lasts after drinking.
This is important because alcohol is metabolized to aldehyde (think:formaldehyde). Alcohol has a half-life of about 2 hours; aldehyde has a half-live of about 6 hours.
Both studies brought subjects' blood alcohol levels to 0.10mg% (the legal limit in many places), then retested their performance repeatedly over time. In both studies, impaired performance was still significant at the end of the observation period: 24 hours in one and 48 hours in the other.

My take from this is that if you get drunk, you are still impaired on Day 3, and we have *no* data showing when you may actually return to normal.

I am sure that many competitors have done their own experiments, and would explain why elite athletes often defer alcohol to the end of the season or campaign.

With activities that produce anxiety, alcohol may improve performance by decreasing anxiety. But there are safer drugs for that (none of which are recommended by aviation medical experts).

On Tuesday, February 19, 2019 at 2:39:11 PM UTC-6, wrote:
It actually was a serious question - I just watched Free Solo - a guy focused on a extremely technical sport. Doesn't drink.

I also have been around several people with Olympic medals - it varies but most only drink at the very end of the competition season - for the reasons of better rest/recovery, focus and no desire to relax.

I have seen a few Kawa interviews and heard him say "If I see a competitor go for a beer, I know I can beat them" - I believe he thought it was more physiological.

--
Dan, 5J

Suddenly, Gary Ittner's generosity in sharing his special brews with pilots at the nationals over the years makes a lot more sense. Has anyone actually witnessed P7 having one himself?

Chip Bearden

On Wednesday, February 20, 2019 at 2:34:05 PM UTC-8, wrote:
Suddenly, Gary Ittner's generosity in sharing his special brews with pilots at the nationals over the years makes a lot more sense. Has anyone actually witnessed P7 having one himself?

Chip Bearden

Yes he makes good beer.

Richard

I am surprised that this subject is even being debated. We have hundreds, if not thousands of years of analyses of consuming alcohol and resulting performance. It isn't a mystery- you don't do well on even simple tasks when drunk. ("Touch your nose. Now stand on one foot. Now put your hands behind your back and let's go downtown.")

A beer or two or three with friends after flying is a longstanding tradition in the aviation and soaring world. (I consider beer to be a reward and celebration with friends after a joyful day swooshing around the sky. We refer to it as 'Aircrew Debriefing Fluid.')

I know I don't fly well the day after drinking too much and so I don't fly with a hangover. If we get into a weather pattern at Moriarty that promises several days of great conditions, I limit my consumption to a level that is commensurate with the time necessary to metabolize the alcohol consumed prior to engaging in aviation related tasks. If I fail to limit the consumption, I just don't fly the next day and kick myself for screwing up.

Judgment is a personal choice, and I certainly respect the attitude of Sebastian Kawa, for obvious reasons. He is simply the best in the world. But I also appreciate the many competition pilots who can kick back and socialize with friends after a long, challenging contest flight. Perhaps they have a beer or two, a couple of glasses of wine, some laughter and camaraderie. It is always a personal choice.

Will you do better in a soaring contest if you completely abstain from consuming alcohol? Maybe, but you can also learn a lot about your competition by hanging out with them after flying.

Remember that being Number One in your particular field shouldn't come by being a judgmental, critical outsider. We do this because it is fun. I don't see too many trophies sponsored by breweries, although I wish I had been around for the Smirnoff Sailplane Derby

On Wednesday, February 20, 2019 at 10:05:08 PM UTC-5, wrote:
I am surprised that this subject is even being debated. We have hundreds, if not thousands of years of analyses of consuming alcohol and resulting performance. It isn't a mystery- you don't do well on even simple tasks when drunk. ("Touch your nose. Now stand on one foot. Now put your hands behind your back and let's go downtown.")

A beer or two or three with friends after flying is a longstanding tradition in the aviation and soaring world. (I consider beer to be a reward and celebration with friends after a joyful day swooshing around the sky. We refer to it as 'Aircrew Debriefing Fluid.')

I know I don't fly well the day after drinking too much and so I don't fly with a hangover. If we get into a weather pattern at Moriarty that promises several days of great conditions, I limit my consumption to a level that is commensurate with the time necessary to metabolize the alcohol consumed prior to engaging in aviation related tasks. If I fail to limit the consumption, I just don't fly the next day and kick myself for screwing up.

Judgment is a personal choice, and I certainly respect the attitude of Sebastian Kawa, for obvious reasons. He is simply the best in the world. But I also appreciate the many competition pilots who can kick back and socialize with friends after a long, challenging contest flight. Perhaps they have a beer or two, a couple of glasses of wine, some laughter and camaraderie. It is always a personal choice.

Will you do better in a soaring contest if you completely abstain from consuming alcohol? Maybe, but you can also learn a lot about your competition by hanging out with them after flying.

Remember that being Number One in your particular field shouldn't come by being a judgmental, critical outsider. We do this because it is fun. I don't see too many trophies sponsored by breweries, although I wish I had been around for the Smirnoff Sailplane Derby

The topic wasn't meant to be a "Debate" - I know RAS loves debates

Since I started it - it was meant to help "me" come up with a bit better "personal" decisions/check lists. sort of like:

I want to do 1000k - make sure i have 8 hours of sleep the 4 nights before - don't drink - call off the task if work is over stress limits........

Before a Contest - don't drink 4 days before or during the contest - sleep in a proper bed - get to sleep before 10 pm - eat only my own cooking.

you get the idea..... RAS has many experience pilots - it can be a place to get diverse opinion and something real data - also a little humor thrown in

Every body reacts to different stress with uniqueness. It in nice to hear how others approach an issue...... it's not a debate, just because you ask a question

WH