Beware travelers with bratty kids

Dylan Smith wrote:
I'm curious - what makes the term 'steward' or
'stewardess' offensive or wrong? I can't think of
any negative connotations of the term which
would do so.

I couldn't agree more! The only difference I can see between
"steward/stewardess" and "flight attendant" is that "stewardess" also
denotes a female. But that's not offensive, it's factual, and there's no
reason why that would have to be private info. What's so offensive or
demeaning or wrong about "stewardess"? It's just an older word for
someone performing the same duties.

Dylan Smith writes:

I'm curious - what makes the term 'steward' or 'stewardess' offensive or
wrong?

Wrong is a strong word.

The most rational objection I've heard is that it's inaccurate because
flight attendants are not actually steward(esse)s. A steward is a
kind of personal assistant, or household domestic, or valet, or
waiter, and so on. Flight attendants, however, are safety
technicians; the usual tasks for which they are best known are in fact
just busy work, because the only reason they are really there is to
help in emergencies. Thus, "flight attendant" is more accurate.

However, most flight attendants don't seem to get hyper if someone
calls them a steward or stewardess. It just means that the passenger
is behind the times, usually--way behind, these days, since FAs
haven't been called stewards in quite a while.

I can't think of any negative connotations of the term which
would do so.

There aren't any negative connotations, unless you think the
traditional functions of a steward are Bad Things. The inaccuracy of
the term favors something like flight attendant, but I don't know why
anyone would be offended.

As far as I know, at least where I live, the collective
term is "cabin crew" and the singular term is "steward" or "stewardess",
and this is what the cabin crew actually call themselves.

Where do you live?

I always thought "flight attendant" sounded slightly demeaning compared
to "steward" or "cabin crew".

It certainly could be taken that way, since it sounds somewhat like
gas-station attendant, and tends to understate the importance of the
job. But perhaps steward sounded too much like a personal slave?

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Dylan Smith writes:
I'm curious - what makes the term 'steward' or 'stewardess' offensive or
wrong?

Mxsmanic wrote:
Wrong is a strong word.

The most rational objection I've heard is that it's inaccurate because
flight attendants are not actually steward(esse)s. A steward is a
kind of personal assistant, or household domestic, or valet, or
waiter, and so on.

The list of definitions (in the dictionary) goes on to include those
responsible for the comfort of passengers on a ship or airplane.

Flight attendants, however, are safety
technicians; the usual tasks for which they are best known are in fact
just busy work, because the only reason they are really there is to
help in emergencies. Thus, "flight attendant" is more accurate.

They were always there to not only do the "busy work" (serve food,
drinks or bring blankets/pillows), but also to provide instruction and
assistance in an emergency.

I wouldn't say "flight attendant is more accurate" as much as it's just
an updated title ... sort of the same way waiter/waitress has been
replaced by "food server". Same job, updated title.

On Sat, 27 Jan 2007 05:27:59 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com wrote:

WTH? My sister in law was a Japanese national (now US citizen) and I asked her
about this one time. She seemed a little confused at the notion that "Oriental"
was somehow offensive. Frankly, so am I. All it refers to is someone from the
Orient. We call people from Europe Europeans and nobody's ass gets chapped.

That one always confused me, as well.

If I were Japanese, Thai, Tibetan, Korean, or Chinese, I think I'd
want to be called Japanese, Thai, Tibetan, Korean, or Chinese. "Asian"
is really no different than "Oriental" as it lumps them all together
based on similar geographic origin. How does "Oriental" offend, but
not "Asian"? It seems to me that if one offends, so should the other,
or neither. I've never referred to the folks I know locally as
Oriental or Asian, because I happen to know they are Thai, Tibetan,
Korean, and Chinese.

Here in New England, we have "Oriental Markets" and stores that sell
"Oriental rugs" and "Oriental antiques". We also have Thai, Tibetan,
Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, and even Korean restaurants.

I never even heard the term "Asian" until I went to California for the
first time. That's also the first time I saw an "Asian Restaurant".
Apparently politically correct people on the west coast can't tell the
difference between Chinese, Thai, and Tibetan food? G

Duncan (NZ) wrote:

"The next time you find yourself on a plane, sitting next to someone who
cannot resist chattering to you endlessly,

I have a very effective way of getting rid off people like that; they
inevitably ask me about my disability, none of their business but in
these occasions I am only too glad to oblige: oh that? airplane
crash, no, no other survivor (entirely true, I was the only
one on board, but I skip that part for the occasion); if I do it
right, I can elaborate a little bit further, it shuts them up for the
rest of the flight (except for some mumbling to themselves)

--Sylvain

I can't believe I'm saying this but what Mxsmanic said is correct.
Please, please, do hold what I just said against me. ;-)


Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
G. Sylvester wrote:
WTH? My sister in law was a Japanese national (now US citizen) and I
asked her
about this one time. She seemed a little confused at the notion that
"Oriental"
was somehow offensive. Frankly, so am I. All it refers to is
someone from the
Orient. We call people from Europe Europeans and nobody's ass gets
chapped.

in all honesty, beats the hell out of me why it is offensive. I learned
this when I was 23 years old when I moved to southern california for
gradual sic school. All I know is when I used the term I got looks
like I had 5 heads. Maybe Kalifornians are a little, ummm, sensitive.
smirk. I certainly did my best to soften them up. Ironically, I was
talking to a friend in NY years later and he told me the same thing.

Gerald





Mxsmanic wrote:
Dylan Smith writes:

I'm curious - what makes the term 'steward' or 'stewardess' offensive or
wrong?

Wrong is a strong word.

The most rational objection I've heard is that it's inaccurate because
flight attendants are not actually steward(esse)s. A steward is a
kind of personal assistant, or household domestic, or valet, or
waiter, and so on. Flight attendants, however, are safety
technicians; the usual tasks for which they are best known are in fact
just busy work, because the only reason they are really there is to
help in emergencies. Thus, "flight attendant" is more accurate.

However, most flight attendants don't seem to get hyper if someone
calls them a steward or stewardess. It just means that the passenger
is behind the times, usually--way behind, these days, since FAs
haven't been called stewards in quite a while.

I can't think of any negative connotations of the term which
would do so.

There aren't any negative connotations, unless you think the
traditional functions of a steward are Bad Things. The inaccuracy of
the term favors something like flight attendant, but I don't know why
anyone would be offended.

As far as I know, at least where I live, the collective
term is "cabin crew" and the singular term is "steward" or "stewardess",
and this is what the cabin crew actually call themselves.

Where do you live?

I always thought "flight attendant" sounded slightly demeaning compared
to "steward" or "cabin crew".

It certainly could be taken that way, since it sounds somewhat like
gas-station attendant, and tends to understate the importance of the
job. But perhaps steward sounded too much like a personal slave?

unicate writes:

The list of definitions (in the dictionary) goes on to include those
responsible for the comfort of passengers on a ship or airplane.

Those definitions are derived from the earlier ones, however.

And the thing is, on an aircraft, FAs are _not_ there to ensure the
comfort of passengers.

They were always there to not only do the "busy work" (serve food,
drinks or bring blankets/pillows), but also to provide instruction and
assistance in an emergency.

Their sole purpose is the latter. Rest assured, if the FAA didn't
require flight attendants, they would have disappeared long ago.

I wouldn't say "flight attendant is more accurate" as much as it's just
an updated title ... sort of the same way waiter/waitress has been
replaced by "food server". Same job, updated title.

In any case, I don't think "stewardess" is likely to produce hysteria
in the average FA.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

G. Sylvester wrote:
I can't believe I'm saying this but what Mxsmanic said is correct.
Please, please, do hold what I just said against me. ;-)


Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:
G. Sylvester wrote:
WTH? My sister in law was a Japanese national (now US citizen) and I
asked her
about this one time. She seemed a little confused at the notion that
"Oriental"
was somehow offensive. Frankly, so am I. All it refers to is
someone from the
Orient. We call people from Europe Europeans and nobody's ass gets
chapped.

in all honesty, beats the hell out of me why it is offensive. I learned
this when I was 23 years old when I moved to southern california for
gradual sic school. All I know is when I used the term I got looks
like I had 5 heads. Maybe Kalifornians are a little, ummm, sensitive.
smirk. I certainly did my best to soften them up. Ironically, I was
talking to a friend in NY years later and he told me the same thing.

Gerald



It's all part of the California PC culture. If you say Asian you are
saying where they or their family is FROM. If you say Oriental you are
making a point of their race.

I have a friend from school that was a South African national and has
become a US Citizen since. He answers African-American when ever
possible. He is VERY Caucasian, blond hair, blue eyes.

For reference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight_attendant


BTW, also found these comments on flyertalk....


I've recently learnt that the words "steward/stewardess"
are being replaced by "attendant" due to political
correctness. Both are AmE or BrE according to my Cambridge Dict (Am
and Br)


Political correctness describes a word or expression that
is used instead of another one to avoid being offensive
Some people think that 'fireman' is a sexist term, and
prefer the politically correct term 'firefighter'.


I try to avoid the issue and say cabin crew for the
group in general, as it's a political correctness issue.


ok, I admit, I'm disgusted with myself for being PC. Jeez. If my
friends find out about this, they'll be ridiculing me for years. The
only reason I used FA vs. steward(ess) was because having flown 600k
plus miles over the past 7 years was FA was the only term I ever heard
used other than the vacation mongers who hang out with "low class" (vs.
business/first class) folk. Now I only wonder if the UA RCC "Dragons"
will take offense to that term.

Ok, lets get off the passenger talk and back to the flying. I guess
that leaves out mxmaniac.


B A R R Y wrote:
On Sat, 27 Jan 2007 05:27:59 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com wrote:
If I were Japanese, Thai, Tibetan, Korean, or Chinese, I think I'd
want to be called Japanese, Thai, Tibetan, Korean, or Chinese. "Asian"
is really no different than "Oriental" as it lumps them all together
based on similar geographic origin.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/oriental has an explanation.
Back in NY it made no difference. Out in the Republik of
Kalifornia, it makes a world of difference. I think I'm going to go
back to the term Oriental.

That's also the first time I saw an "Asian Restaurant".
Apparently politically correct people on the west coast can't tell the
difference between Chinese, Thai, and Tibetan food? G

please, do not discriminate. We're all Americans...you know, one nation
under gawd, all that grin

Gerald

On Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:33:42 -0600, 601XL Builder
wrDOTgiacona@suddenlinkDOTnet wrote:



It's all part of the California PC culture. If you say Asian you are
saying where they or their family is FROM. If you say Oriental you are
making a point of their race.

_The ORIENT_ is a place, just like Asia! G

There's even an airline named after the Orient as a place.