If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#161
|
|||
|
|||
"Chip Jones" wrote in message link.net... "Tom S." wrote in message ... "Chip Jones" wrote: Who cares about a system model for what comes next? American government works best when we run it like a business, Sounds nice, but it's a myth. One can't run a government like a business because the rules are the inverse of one another (bureaucracy vs. flexibility of decision making). just like Enron, MCI, or any major airline (say Eastern, Pan Am, TWA etc). And those companies tired to run the business like a government. Now that's an interesting point, Tom. :-) Well taken. Who destroyed those companies? The management? To a great extend, they did; they tried to run like a bureaucracy. But what really did them in? The (relatively) free market; they could bribe (see: PAC and campaign contributions) a few legislators, but they can't fool millions of consumers. A government can't run like a business (not a limited government), nor can a business hope to endure when run as a bureaucracy (i.e., a government). The next time your say government is a hopeless bureaucracy, but glad it is, because tight rules and restrictions are what a limited government are all about (not to be confused with Third World governments in which bureaucracy exists for graft and corruption). |
#162
|
|||
|
|||
"Icebound" wrote in message able.rogers.com... Tom S. wrote: "Chip Jones" wrote: Who cares about a system model for what comes next? American government works best when we run it like a business, Sounds nice, but it's a myth. One can't run a government like a business because the rules are the inverse of one another (bureaucracy vs. flexibility of decision making). just like Enron, MCI, or any major airline (say Eastern, Pan Am, TWA etc). And those companies tired to run the business like a government. Not nearly. There is quite a difference between inefficiency and outright deception and fraud. In that case, it's EXACTLY like government. Failure to deliver by public agencies is often as much the fault of the shareholders' (taxpayers) lack of investment as it is the fault of management's incompetence. Government agencies can be as flexible as large private companies, if they have some assurance of continuity of budget and programs. But if all the management hours have to be spent figuring out how to cut as opposed to what and how to deliver, then what do you expect? See my post about LIMITED government. There is no way they can be "flexible" and legitimate. |
#163
|
|||
|
|||
"Icebound" wrote in message able.rogers.com... The bottom line is that you have little way of knowing if the company you choose to run your ATC will operate like a "good" company or a bad one... so would you rather have a Government agency screw it up, which is at least somewhat under the scrutiny of press and public, or a private company screw it up, which can hide its shady dealings until it's too late. Looks like that scrutiny has been such an advantage til now. One group that WILL NOT stand ofr incompetence is the consumers in a market. Guess who beat the media and the government to to the punch on Enron, MCI, etc. [rest of naiveté snipped] |
#164
|
|||
|
|||
Tom S. wrote:
... One group that WILL NOT stand ofr incompetence is the consumers in a market. ... Consumers do not make wise choices. They do not care a damn about competance at all... They care about the lowest short-term cost. Hence they opt for the 2-dollar-per-day offshore wages and no pollution controls. I am not sure whether that qualifies as competence/efficiency. I am not sure that consumers have that much power. They are forced to operate in an existing infrastructure... infrastructure that is largely the long-term result of corporate and government policy. There is no easy way of knowing if it is the most efficient infrastructure or not. |
#165
|
|||
|
|||
Well, for what it's worth, I called the tower and asked about the
clearance. The tower supervisor I spoke to said they ALWAYS assign the SID. If the clearance delivery guy didn't read me the SID, he goofed. If he did but I just didn't hear it, I goofed. If I read it back without the SID and he didn't correct me, he goofed. One way or another, if I didn't have the SID written down, somebody goofed somewhere. I imagine we could have pulled the tapes and listend to them, but it just didn't seem worthwhile going to that trouble. |
#166
|
|||
|
|||
"Icebound" wrote in message . rogers.com... Tom S. wrote: ... One group that WILL NOT stand ofr incompetence is the consumers in a market. ... Consumers do not make wise choices. They do not care a damn about competance at all... They care about the lowest short-term cost. Hence they opt for the 2-dollar-per-day offshore wages and no pollution controls. I am not sure whether that qualifies as competence/efficiency. And I suppose YOU do make wise choices? I am not sure that consumers have that much power. They are forced to operate in an existing infrastructure... infrastructure that is largely the long-term result of corporate and government policy. Welcome to reality and prosperity. There is no easy way of knowing if it is the most efficient infrastructure or not. Welcome to reality. |
#167
|
|||
|
|||
Ron Rosenfeld wrote: On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 00:19:39 -0800, wrote: I think you're missing my point. There are many IFR airports that have Part 97 IFR takeoff minimums but no ODP because they are 40:1-clear in all directions once reaching 400 feet. That is the result of a survey by the feds. There aren't any such surveys or takeoff minimums at VFR airports but some Part 91 pilots don't understand the distinction since takeoff minimums are mandatory for them. That's a different point than what you wrote in response to my comment about flying ODP's. It is? Sounds like one, or perhaps both of us, is confused. I understood you to say that a VFR airport wouldn't have an OPD. True enough. But, many IFR airports don't have ODPs either. So, the existence of absense of an OPD is not the real clue; takeoff minimums or lack thereof is the more important clue. |
#168
|
|||
|
|||
Roy Smith wrote: Well, for what it's worth, I called the tower and asked about the clearance. The tower supervisor I spoke to said they ALWAYS assign the SID. If the clearance delivery guy didn't read me the SID, he goofed. If he did but I just didn't hear it, I goofed. If I read it back without the SID and he didn't correct me, he goofed. One way or another, if I didn't have the SID written down, somebody goofed somewhere. I imagine we could have pulled the tapes and listend to them, but it just didn't seem worthwhile going to that trouble. Moral: Oh so fragile is that 1930's-era AM VHF audio comm link. |
#169
|
|||
|
|||
|
#170
|
|||
|
|||
On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 17:54:25 -0500, Roy Smith wrote:
Well, for what it's worth, I called the tower and asked about the clearance. The tower supervisor I spoke to said they ALWAYS assign the SID. If the clearance delivery guy didn't read me the SID, he goofed. If he did but I just didn't hear it, I goofed. If I read it back without the SID and he didn't correct me, he goofed. One way or another, if I didn't have the SID written down, somebody goofed somewhere. I imagine we could have pulled the tapes and listend to them, but it just didn't seem worthwhile going to that trouble. And as of now, the "goof" has resulted in 175 messages in this thread! Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA) |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
GPS approaches with Center | Dan Luke | Instrument Flight Rules | 104 | October 22nd 03 09:42 PM |
IFR Routing Toronto to Windsor (CYTZ - CYQG) | Rob Pesan | Instrument Flight Rules | 5 | October 7th 03 01:50 PM |
required readback on clearance | [email protected] | Instrument Flight Rules | 15 | September 17th 03 04:33 PM |
Picking up a Clearance Airborne | Brad Z | Instrument Flight Rules | 30 | August 29th 03 01:31 AM |
Big John Bites Dicks (Security Clearance) | Badwater Bill | Home Built | 27 | August 21st 03 12:40 AM |