Fuel Truck

Your partnership would have to have a taxable income greater than the 179
deduction to qualify for the deduction.
--
Jim Burns III

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"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Ben Smith" wrote in message
...
I'd agree with the previous posters, and check with the local fuel
wholesalers.. They should definately know someone out there who might
be
itching to sell a truck.. They could also give good information on what
'other' aspects you'll need to cover such as needing a CDL, Hazmat
permits,
and other red tape.

Thanks! I don't plan to drive on public roads.


Will this be to buy your own bulk fuel for the MU-2? Any idea where you
will store the truck, and if there are insurance / legal concerns with
it?


The truck would be stored outside on a hanger apron.

There is no fuel truck at SZT anymore, only self serve, and there are
several hangers, including mine, diagonally across the airport from the
pumps. It is a PITA and expensive to taxi over to the pumps particularly
for an early AM departure. If it is snowing the airplane may need to be
deiced after refueling. Also I prefer to have the plane fueled the night
before departure and I don't want to taxi back from the fuel pumps turn
the
plane around and push it back into the hanger.

With the increased 179 deduction we can expense the truck the first year
and
the fuel cost savings should more than pay for the balance

and if there are insurance / legal concerns with it?

This is something we will have to factor in but if the truck is not used
on
public roads I don't think that it will be a major hurdle.
Mike
MU-2


Hopefully it'll all work out for you. So far, looks like buying the
truck
will be the easiest part!

--
Ben
C-172 - N13258 @ 87Y

"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message
nk.net...

The truck would be stored outside on a hanger apron.

Mike,

I believe that EPA has or is in the process of mandating containment for
mobile refuelers. A few other points to consider:

Jet-A loves water and allows bacterial growth. Prist, in addition to being
an antifreeze, is an anti-bacterial. Jet in storage needs to be circulated
to keep the Prist properly mixed. Additionally, there are fairly rigid
standards regarding filtration of Jet fuel. These standards are insurance
driven, which brings up another point. If your FBO's arrangement is
typical, they carry liability insurance for the first part of a claim.
Excess liability coverage is provided by the fuel supplier. This coverage
is contingent on the proper storage and conditioning of the fuel. Ours
refused to sell us fuel unless the system met their standards. Look at the
Jet fuel system sometime. Note the filters and valving. It is set up to be
able to circulate and filter the fuel in the tank. As the fuel is
off-loaded from the delivery truck, it is filtered. As it is delivered into
your plane, it is also filtered. Any tanker that stores fuel should have
the same capability.

The tanker will also have to be epoxy coated in the inside to prevent rust.
If you buy a jet refueler, it should already be set up correctly with epoxy
and filtration, but that should be verified. Your FBO's fuel supplier
should be happy to explain their requirements for fuel handling. You
probably would want to "donate" the truck to the FBO in return for low fuel
rates, just to avoid the hassles and potential liability. Alternatively, a
variation on the "Mighty Grape" might better fit your needs, even if it took
a couple of trips to fuel the plane.

I had to research this 3 years ago when the company I work for bought a
Citation Bravo. We ultimately abandoned the refueler idea, and opted to buy
a 10,000 gallon Jet system, which we donated to the city. In return, we buy
fuel at a deep discount for a specific length of time. Avgas systems are
dirt simple in comparison.

If you're still looking at refuelers, Aero-Trader has a 2,000 gallon truck
in the current issue. 817 area code puts it in the Ft. Worth area.

Hope this is helpful,

Dick Meade

"Dick Meade" wrote in message ...


Jet-A loves water and allows bacterial growth. Prist, in addition to being
an antifreeze, is an anti-bacterial.

Of course, Prist can no longer make this claim because the EPA has made it
commercially prohibitive to certify something as a pesticide. It's officially
an anti-icing additive...if you no longer have to worry about crud growing in
your fuel, all the better.

While bacteria will grow in the fuel, it's actually fungus (Hormoconis Resinae)
that's the real problem. It's not just the water but the fact that this bugger likes
to eat the fuel. The bacteria tends to stay with the water and thus is removed
by the normal water traps...and filling up with fresh fuel alleviates the problem.
The fungus likes to hang out on the surfaces in your tank and you'll continue
to have an infestation until you actively put something in to kill it.

Thanks, I was aware of most of these issues but not the containment one. I
agree that the best approach is to lease or donate the truck in return for
low cost fuel. I am also considering a fixed site system but then I would
need to buy the land and pay property taxes on it forever as well as
maintain the system.

Mike
MU-2



"Dick Meade" wrote in message
...

"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message
nk.net...

The truck would be stored outside on a hanger apron.

Mike,

I believe that EPA has or is in the process of mandating containment for
mobile refuelers. A few other points to consider:

Jet-A loves water and allows bacterial growth. Prist, in addition to
being
an antifreeze, is an anti-bacterial. Jet in storage needs to be
circulated
to keep the Prist properly mixed. Additionally, there are fairly rigid
standards regarding filtration of Jet fuel. These standards are insurance
driven, which brings up another point. If your FBO's arrangement is
typical, they carry liability insurance for the first part of a claim.
Excess liability coverage is provided by the fuel supplier. This coverage
is contingent on the proper storage and conditioning of the fuel. Ours
refused to sell us fuel unless the system met their standards. Look at
the
Jet fuel system sometime. Note the filters and valving. It is set up to
be
able to circulate and filter the fuel in the tank. As the fuel is
off-loaded from the delivery truck, it is filtered. As it is delivered
into
your plane, it is also filtered. Any tanker that stores fuel should have
the same capability.

The tanker will also have to be epoxy coated in the inside to prevent
rust.
If you buy a jet refueler, it should already be set up correctly with
epoxy
and filtration, but that should be verified. Your FBO's fuel supplier
should be happy to explain their requirements for fuel handling. You
probably would want to "donate" the truck to the FBO in return for low
fuel
rates, just to avoid the hassles and potential liability. Alternatively,
a
variation on the "Mighty Grape" might better fit your needs, even if it
took
a couple of trips to fuel the plane.

I had to research this 3 years ago when the company I work for bought a
Citation Bravo. We ultimately abandoned the refueler idea, and opted to
buy
a 10,000 gallon Jet system, which we donated to the city. In return, we
buy
fuel at a deep discount for a specific length of time. Avgas systems are
dirt simple in comparison.

If you're still looking at refuelers, Aero-Trader has a 2,000 gallon truck
in the current issue. 817 area code puts it in the Ft. Worth area.

Hope this is helpful,

Dick Meade

"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message nk.net...
I would like to buy a fuel truck! 5,000 to 10,000 gallon preferred. I have
been watching ebay and rbauction.com and I was wondering if anyone knew of
other sources? How can I find out if the government is selling one?
Thanks!

Always some in Trade-A-Plane each month.

On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 14:57:37 GMT, "Mike Rapoport"
wrote:

I would like to buy a fuel truck! 5,000 to 10,000 gallon preferred. I have
been watching ebay and rbauction.com and I was wondering if anyone knew of
other sources? How can I find out if the government is selling one?
Thanks!

For fueling the MU2? That's a creative way to save some bucks.

Morris airport in Illinois just added huge self-serve tanks to the
field. Not sure if they are keeping their trucks, but it might be
worth a phone call as they appear to be relatively new and in good
condition). Morris airport is at: 815-942-1600

You can see a picture of the trucks in the background of this photo:
http://www.needlescentered.com/needl...is_800x600.jpg

Hell, I'd drive the thing out to Utah or Idaho, or wherever you live,
if you fly me back to Chicago in the MU2.

-Nathan

"Nathan Young" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 14:57:37 GMT, "Mike Rapoport"
wrote:

I would like to buy a fuel truck! 5,000 to 10,000 gallon preferred. I
have
been watching ebay and rbauction.com and I was wondering if anyone knew
of
other sources? How can I find out if the government is selling one?
Thanks!

For fueling the MU2? That's a creative way to save some bucks.

Morris airport in Illinois just added huge self-serve tanks to the
field. Not sure if they are keeping their trucks, but it might be
worth a phone call as they appear to be relatively new and in good
condition). Morris airport is at: 815-942-1600

You can see a picture of the trucks in the background of this photo:
http://www.needlescentered.com/needl...is_800x600.jpg

Hell, I'd drive the thing out to Utah or Idaho, or wherever you live,
if you fly me back to Chicago in the MU2.

You got it! Is that your Cessna in the picture?

Mike
MU-2


-Nathan

On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 18:22:17 GMT, "Mike Rapoport"
wrote:

"Nathan Young" wrote in message

You can see a picture of the trucks in the background of this photo:
http://www.needlescentered.com/needl...is_800x600.jpg

Hell, I'd drive the thing out to Utah or Idaho, or wherever you live,
if you fly me back to Chicago in the MU2.

You got it! Is that your Cessna in the picture?

Nope, but I thought it was a nice looking 170, so I took the picture
last time I flew into Morris for lunch.

-Nathan

In article et,
Mike Rapoport wrote:
I would like to buy a fuel truck! 5,000 to 10,000 gallon preferred.

You're just fueling one plane, right? Why not a stationary tank? If
it can't be a permanent structure, you could just get a semi trailer
tank and park it. Hire a trucking company if you ever need to move it.

--
Ben Jackson

http://www.ben.com/

"Ben Jackson" wrote in message
news:UiVMb.44612$8H.98932@attbi_s03...
In article et,
Mike Rapoport wrote:
I would like to buy a fuel truck! 5,000 to 10,000 gallon preferred.

You're just fueling one plane, right? Why not a stationary tank? If
it can't be a permanent structure, you could just get a semi trailer
tank and park it. Hire a trucking company if you ever need to move it.

There will actually be a couple of planes and owners. I have thought about
a trailer but does a tailer have a pump? A trailer has a lot of advantages
such as being able to hire a trucker to take it to be filled.

Mike
MU-2

--
Ben Jackson

http://www.ben.com/