Did you ever give up on an IR?

Headset off, unzip coat, touch chin to chest, reach straight back over
shoulders and grab the back of your coat, pull the back of your coat up
and
forward over your head so now you have your arms still in the sleeves and
are looking at the back of your coat with the collar between your wrists.

Ah, you must be younger than me. The last time I tried that maneuver in
flight, I got the coat over my head and was stricken with a terrible muscle
cramp in my right shoulder.

So there we were, flying high over the Midwest, Mary at the yoke (and
laughing hysterically, BTW), as I'm dying in agony with my coat stuck over
my head, unable to move...

It wasn't pretty... I now make sure my coat is OFF before departure. ;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

In article 2nxub.240040$Tr4.703005@attbi_s03, Jay Honeck
wrote:

Headset off, unzip coat, touch chin to chest, reach straight back over
shoulders and grab the back of your coat, pull the back of your coat up
and
forward over your head so now you have your arms still in the sleeves and
are looking at the back of your coat with the collar between your wrists.

Ah, you must be younger than me. The last time I tried that maneuver in
flight, I got the coat over my head and was stricken with a terrible muscle
cramp in my right shoulder.

So there we were, flying high over the Midwest, Mary at the yoke (and
laughing hysterically, BTW), as I'm dying in agony with my coat stuck over
my head, unable to move...

It wasn't pretty... I now make sure my coat is OFF before departure. ;-)

You guys make taking a coat off too difficult.
All on has to do is reach behind with one arm, grab the cuff of the
opposite sleeve and pull your arm out. Reach around behind you with the
unsleeved arm, grab the cuff and pull the other arm out of the sleeve.

"No Such User" wrote in message
...
I wonder if I have what it takes to get an instrument rating. I can fly
just fine when the air is smooth, but if there's any turbulence I can
last at most two minutes before I have to choose between taking off the
hood or losing my lunch. The general consensus seems to be that this
will go away eventually, but I haven't seen any sign of it.

So to all those pilots out there, how many of you gave up on an IR because
of motion sickness? How many of you started out getting queasy but
eventually got over it?

Also, in case you're tempted to offer your home remedy, I've already
tried the usual tricks, e.g., ginger, light eating, no eating, high-carb
eating, the electric wrist-strap gizmo. Nothing helps.

I've had some long term problems with motion sickness. Only occassionally
under the hood in hot and bumby conditions. Never in actual.

Dramamine works but dull headedness may be a problem. Scopalomine patches
worked real well for me with no apparent side effects. I hear they may be
back on the market (?). If I was glider flying again I would scour the
world and find a lifetime supply. None of the rest of the stuff ever helped
me.

I definitely developed some psychological problems associated with motion
sickness. Certain kinds of weather would upset my stomach before I took
off. Having an effective treatment (Scopalomine) seemed to let me get past
the anticipation of air sickness. Hope that hasn't happened to you.
Perhaps try a different hood, different head position or try to get some
actual just to show that it might be easier than the hood. Confidence helps
but if you were like me, a bag is best.

Try it without the hood on.

If it still bothers you try seeing your Ear Nose and Throat.

The hood causes me problems when I am in training. I have over two
hundred Instrument hours and I still hate the hood. Try the Jepp Flip up
"Glasses" They seem to be better for me.

Michelle

No Such User wrote:

I wonder if I have what it takes to get an instrument rating. I can fly
just fine when the air is smooth, but if there's any turbulence I can
last at most two minutes before I have to choose between taking off the
hood or losing my lunch. The general consensus seems to be that this
will go away eventually, but I haven't seen any sign of it.

So to all those pilots out there, how many of you gave up on an IR because
of motion sickness? How many of you started out getting queasy but
eventually got over it?

Also, in case you're tempted to offer your home remedy, I've already
tried the usual tricks, e.g., ginger, light eating, no eating, high-carb
eating, the electric wrist-strap gizmo. Nothing helps.




--

Michelle P ATP-ASEL, CP-AMEL, and AMT-A&P

"Elisabeth" a Maule M-7-235B (no two are alike)

Volunteer Pilot, Angel Flight Mid-Atlantic

Volunteer Builder, Habitat for Humanity

The hood causes me problems when I am in training. I have over two
hundred Instrument hours and I still hate the hood. Try the Jepp Flip up
"Glasses" They seem to be better for me.

Michelle

The headband on the hood was always too tight and it gave me a headache. The
I would feel sick. Slackening the headband would cause it to fall down over
my face. The only answer was to fly in actual IMC head up.

It may be legal to receive dual instruction while taking Dramamine if your
instructor is apprised of the situation and is willing to be the PIC, and
you do not log the time as PIC. Logged dual time and simulated instrument
time does not have to be as PIC to be used to qualify for the rating.
Perhaps experiencing hooded flight without bad symptoms would help. Maybe
Foggies would also help, or a different hood.

I had to fly dual with a CFII for a couple of months while my med cert was
in the Twinkie Zone in OK City, in the aftermath of my Obstructive Sleep
Apnea disclosure. No PIC. No problem, besides not being able to use the
airplane for transportation. I believe any flight where you are not
medically legal to be in command can be handled the same way.

Good luck!

-Greg

PS I'm a lucky one. 84 hours of instrument time and no motion sickness or
signs of vertigo. Yet.

"No Such User" wrote in message
...
I wonder if I have what it takes to get an instrument rating. I can fly
just fine when the air is smooth, but if there's any turbulence I can
last at most two minutes before I have to choose between taking off the
hood or losing my lunch. The general consensus seems to be that this
will go away eventually, but I haven't seen any sign of it.

So to all those pilots out there, how many of you gave up on an IR because
of motion sickness? How many of you started out getting queasy but
eventually got over it?

Also, in case you're tempted to offer your home remedy, I've already
tried the usual tricks, e.g., ginger, light eating, no eating, high-carb
eating, the electric wrist-strap gizmo. Nothing helps.

Talk with your local Aviation Medical Examiner about techniques to cure
motion sickness. I know the AME at my school has techniques. I havn't had a
problem with motion sickness so I havn' talked with him about it.

Good Luck

"Greg Goodknight" wrote in message
hlink.net...
It may be legal to receive dual instruction while taking Dramamine if your
instructor is apprised of the situation and is willing to be the PIC, and
you do not log the time as PIC. Logged dual time and simulated instrument
time does not have to be as PIC to be used to qualify for the rating.
Perhaps experiencing hooded flight without bad symptoms would help. Maybe
Foggies would also help, or a different hood.

I had to fly dual with a CFII for a couple of months while my med cert was
in the Twinkie Zone in OK City, in the aftermath of my Obstructive Sleep
Apnea disclosure. No PIC. No problem, besides not being able to use the
airplane for transportation. I believe any flight where you are not
medically legal to be in command can be handled the same way.

Good luck!

-Greg

PS I'm a lucky one. 84 hours of instrument time and no motion sickness or
signs of vertigo. Yet.

"No Such User" wrote in message
...
I wonder if I have what it takes to get an instrument rating. I can fly
just fine when the air is smooth, but if there's any turbulence I can
last at most two minutes before I have to choose between taking off the
hood or losing my lunch. The general consensus seems to be that this
will go away eventually, but I haven't seen any sign of it.

So to all those pilots out there, how many of you gave up on an IR
because
of motion sickness? How many of you started out getting queasy but
eventually got over it?

Also, in case you're tempted to offer your home remedy, I've already
tried the usual tricks, e.g., ginger, light eating, no eating, high-carb
eating, the electric wrist-strap gizmo. Nothing helps.

Greg

Must have deleted the original posting from "No such user" (?) so will
post here and hope 'he' reads?

Motion sickness practicing instruments.

1. Hold our head STILL and just move your eyes for the cross check. If
you move your head the inner ear and the instruments disagree and this
can lead to vertigo and motion sickness. Have your ears checked for
any unusual or damaged inner ears.

2. Keep cockpit COLD and cold air blowing in your face. A warm (hot)
cockpit with the smells of the airplane can help give motion sickness.
This might mean that you would have to fly your instrument training in
the winter time?

3. Chew gum.

4. Keep busy. Talk to instructor, etc. Anything that takes your mind
off the motion sickness will stop or prevent it.

Do maneuvers that take mental concentration, ie., LEVEL turns (+/-
five feet). climbs and descents to specific altitudes at specific
rates. Intersect and track in and out bound. Approaches of various
kinds. There are a multitude of maneuvers that require concentration
on then and would take your mind off the motion and help prevent/stop
any motion sickness.
..
4. I agree with the comment that continued exposure will help stop
motion sickness assuming that you are not suspectable to sea sickness,
auto sickness, etc. and have a medical problem.

5. Go ahead and fly with an IP and take motion sickness prevention
pills, stick on patches, etc. Slowly decrease them as you continue to
fly. As you decrease them the body should start taking over until you
can quit altogether.

In closing. Good luck in your training and hope you get the rating and
are comfortable flying instruments.

Big John

On motion sickness experience. I used to catch rides in the back end
or a C-47 that was flying 3-4K in the midwest in the summer time. That
thing would swing and sway and it was hot and I puked every time.
Persistence and other things I mentioned cured me even though when I
was actively instructing in the T-33 in Arizona, a student could make
me queazy. I then took the controls for 5 minutes and demonstrated
something which calmed my stomach down and then gave bird back to
student.

Go get'm tiger )

BJ

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 20:33:55 GMT, "Greg Goodknight"
wrote:

----clip----

Good luck!

-Greg

PS I'm a lucky one. 84 hours of instrument time and no motion sickness or
signs of vertigo. Yet.

"No Such User" wrote in message
...
I wonder if I have what it takes to get an instrument rating. I can fly
just fine when the air is smooth, but if there's any turbulence I can
last at most two minutes before I have to choose between taking off the
hood or losing my lunch. The general consensus seems to be that this
will go away eventually, but I haven't seen any sign of it.

So to all those pilots out there, how many of you gave up on an IR because
of motion sickness? How many of you started out getting queasy but
eventually got over it?

Also, in case you're tempted to offer your home remedy, I've already
tried the usual tricks, e.g., ginger, light eating, no eating, high-carb
eating, the electric wrist-strap gizmo. Nothing helps.

In article , Big John wrote:

Motion sickness practicing instruments.

2. Keep cockpit COLD and cold air blowing in your face. A warm (hot)
cockpit with the smells of the airplane can help give motion sickness.
This might mean that you would have to fly your instrument training in
the winter time?

I do this already, much to the discomfort of my instructor.

3. Chew gum.

Never tried that. Don't know what good it would do, but I'm willing
to try anything.

4. Keep busy. Talk to instructor, etc. Anything that takes your mind
off the motion sickness will stop or prevent it.

Nope. It comes when it comes.

Do maneuvers that take mental concentration, ie., LEVEL turns (+/-
five feet). climbs and descents to specific altitudes at specific
rates. Intersect and track in and out bound. Approaches of various
kinds. There are a multitude of maneuvers that require concentration
on then and would take your mind off the motion and help prevent/stop
any motion sickness.
.
This doesn't seem to work. I had been hoping that concentration would
stave off the nausea, but it never happened.

4. I agree with the comment that continued exposure will help stop
motion sickness assuming that you are not suspectable to sea sickness,
auto sickness, etc. and have a medical problem.

This seems to be the consensus of all with experience with this.
Fortunately for my aspirations, no one replied with, "yes, I had to
give up on instrument flying." Most everyone who mentioned having
my problem said they eventually got over it. I'll keep clutching that
particular straw.

As for susceptibility, I suppose I'm a minor motion sickness case.
I can't read for very long in the back seat of a moving car, but I
can read all day on an airliner or a train, suggesting that it's all
frequency-dependent. I can ride around in a small boat with no problem,
but once it stops and just bobs on the water I start to get queasy.

5. Go ahead and fly with an IP and take motion sickness prevention
pills, stick on patches, etc. Slowly decrease them as you continue to
fly. As you decrease them the body should start taking over until you
can quit altogether.

I'll ask my instructor if he's cool with that.

On motion sickness experience. I used to catch rides in the back end
or a C-47 that was flying 3-4K in the midwest in the summer time. That
thing would swing and sway and it was hot and I puked every time.
Persistence and other things I mentioned cured me even though when I
was actively instructing in the T-33 in Arizona, a student could make
me queazy. I then took the controls for 5 minutes and demonstrated
something which calmed my stomach down and then gave bird back to
student.

Apparently, Chuck Yeager's first flying experience caused him to toss
his cookies, and somehow he got over it. Maybe there's hope for me yet.
If not, there's always my father's advice: "eat your dessert first--
it'll come up last and taste better."

One other thought.

I know two people who tried hypnosis for other things. One guy used
it to get through nicotine withdrawal. The other guy stopped
stuttering.

The smoker, that was ok. He was motivated (new father) and he just
had to hold out for the withdrawal period. The stutterer figures it
was a mistake -- he was hardwired for stuttering and the hypnosis set
up a tension -- that finally broke when he experienced a big scare*.
He started stuttering again after that, but felt more normal.

If your motion sickness is a software problem, maybe hypnosis would
help.

Don
*He and his wife survived an airliner crash that killed other pax.