Of parachutes and things

ShawnD2112 wrote:
Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D. The top US contenders
seem to be National and Softie but with no experience in the field, and
parachutes not exactly being the kind of object you can try on for size in
the shop, I don't really know what to look for and what to avoid. I'd
appreciate any tips anyone out there could provide. Are there any European
models that anyone has any experience with? Obviously comfort and space in
the cockpit are major considerations.

Thanks!
Shawn


If you buy used, ask the seller for the manufacturing date. Many
riggers will not repack a canopy that is older than 20 years old. Also
check for ADs.

Butler has a very good discusion on parachute selection at:
http://www.butlerparachutes.com/howto.htm

And:
http://www.butlerparachutes.com/PDF/HowToSelect.pdf

You really need to talk to other pitts pilots. If the backpack is too
tall, it could ride up and create problems with the shoulder restraint
straps; that wouldn't be desirable when flying upside down. Here is a
quote from the Butler web page:

"In many aircraft with relatively upright seating (close to 90o, such as
the Citabria, 1-26, etc.), a backpack parachute is usually the best
choice. However, the pack must be long enough to rest on the seat bottom
and support its own weight without dragging on the shoulders of the
wearer. Conversely, it must not be so long that it rides up around the
wearer’s ears and forces the shoulder restraint straps up unnecessarily.

If the pilot desires a back type parachute in an aircraft such as the
Pitts (and similar types like Great Lakes, Skybolt, etc.) with tight
cockpits, relatively upright seating and close clearance between the
pilot’s face and the instrument panel, we generally recommend a back
parachute that is thickest at the bottom and thinnest at the top in
order to keep your face out of the instruments. Of course, the problem
with the thickness at the bottom is that you may begin to run out of leg
room."


For added info, do a search on "tso-c23b" or "tso-c23c"

Marty Pautz
"promote a society that respects its elders; before it is too late."

Butler will work with you on getting the fit correct.
He used to post of one of the groups, but I haven't seen anything from
him for awhile.

I highly suggest the Paraphenalia Softie with the aerobatic harness.
It gets the hardware out of the way from the restraints. Especailliy
if you put in a ratchet harnes like a Hooker.

Also, you can get the Softie with Aerobatic Harness as either a back
pack or seat pack.

-j-

On Mon, 28 Jun 2004 18:24:10 +0100, "ShawnD2112"
wrote:

Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D. The top US contenders
seem to be National and Softie but with no experience in the field, and
parachutes not exactly being the kind of object you can try on for size in
the shop, I don't really know what to look for and what to avoid. I'd
appreciate any tips anyone out there could provide. Are there any European
models that anyone has any experience with? Obviously comfort and space in
the cockpit are major considerations.

Thanks!
Shawn

Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D. The top US contenders
seem to be National and Softie but with no experience in the field, and
parachutes not exactly being the kind of object you can try on for size in
the shop, I don't really know what to look for and what to avoid.

I'm 6 ft. and 200 lb. I used a "Mini-Softie" backpack in the S1 ("C" fuselage,
"S" wings) that I flew for several years, and was satisfied that it was the
best fit for that airplane.

When I switched to an S-2B, I bought two Wedge Softies (also backpacks), which
are thicker at the bottom than at the top. The S-2B has good legroom, the Wedge
leans me back a bit and I have more distance from face to inst. panel. Again,
the right choice; it's very comfortable, even for 10 hr. flying days.

BUT....the Wedge doesn't work for me in the S-1, because the latter is very
short on legroom. If I were 3 or 4 inches shorter, it would be a different
story, and the Wedge would be OK. It might also be OK in a "long fuselage" S-1S
or T. But I think the D is short.

Some folks like the "chair pack" which has a flap below the butt to help hold
the chute in place during negative G. I don't find any problem with the
straight backpack or the Wedge here, at least not up to -5 g's, which is about
all I ever do.

My Mini Softie had the pelvis-bruising buckles, which I thought were OK, so I
ordered the Wedge's that way. After I started flying serious advanced, the
bleeding started bothering me so at repack time, I had Dan convert my favorite
Wedge to the aerobatic harness. Problem solved.

If you can, borrow chutes from friends to try, or if you are close to a
parachute shop, fly in to visit. Dan at Paraphernalia in Arlington (WA) has
been more than accomodating to me. It's only about 220 NM from home for me, so
stopping in isn't difficult. Go to a nearby contest and you'll find 20 to 50
pilots with every conceivable type of parachute, and they'll probably all be
willing to advise and help. Especially the big ones (pilots, that is)...it's a
battle for all of us!

Doug Sowder

That's great feedback, everyone. Thanks very much. The problem I have at
the moment is that I live in the UK and don't know of any dealers around
which I could fly to and try several on in the airplane. The Softie with
the aerobatic harness sounds like a good bet, though, based on the comments
here.

Thanks, everyone, for taking the time to drop a line in. Much appreciated.

Shawn
"DSowder" wrote in message
...
Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D. The top US
contenders
seem to be National and Softie but with no experience in the field, and
parachutes not exactly being the kind of object you can try on for size
in
the shop, I don't really know what to look for and what to avoid.

I'm 6 ft. and 200 lb. I used a "Mini-Softie" backpack in the S1 ("C"
fuselage,
"S" wings) that I flew for several years, and was satisfied that it was
the
best fit for that airplane.

When I switched to an S-2B, I bought two Wedge Softies (also backpacks),
which
are thicker at the bottom than at the top. The S-2B has good legroom, the
Wedge
leans me back a bit and I have more distance from face to inst. panel.
Again,
the right choice; it's very comfortable, even for 10 hr. flying days.

BUT....the Wedge doesn't work for me in the S-1, because the latter is
very
short on legroom. If I were 3 or 4 inches shorter, it would be a different
story, and the Wedge would be OK. It might also be OK in a "long fuselage"
S-1S
or T. But I think the D is short.

Some folks like the "chair pack" which has a flap below the butt to help
hold
the chute in place during negative G. I don't find any problem with the
straight backpack or the Wedge here, at least not up to -5 g's, which is
about
all I ever do.

My Mini Softie had the pelvis-bruising buckles, which I thought were OK,
so I
ordered the Wedge's that way. After I started flying serious advanced, the
bleeding started bothering me so at repack time, I had Dan convert my
favorite
Wedge to the aerobatic harness. Problem solved.

If you can, borrow chutes from friends to try, or if you are close to a
parachute shop, fly in to visit. Dan at Paraphernalia in Arlington (WA)
has
been more than accomodating to me. It's only about 220 NM from home for
me, so
stopping in isn't difficult. Go to a nearby contest and you'll find 20 to
50
pilots with every conceivable type of parachute, and they'll probably all
be
willing to advise and help. Especially the big ones (pilots, that
is)...it's a
battle for all of us!

Doug Sowder

"ShawnD2112" wrote in message
news:AnZDc.1369$Dq1.851@newsfe6-win...
Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D. The top US
contenders
seem to be National and Softie but with no experience in the field, and
parachutes not exactly being the kind of object you can try on for size in
the shop, I don't really know what to look for and what to avoid. I'd
appreciate any tips anyone out there could provide. Are there any
European
models that anyone has any experience with? Obviously comfort and space
in
the cockpit are major considerations.

Thanks!
Shawn


FWIW, I fly with a Softie seat parachute in my Yak. I don't have any back
room or leg room in the Yak but the seat box is deep. The seat cushion in
the plane is removable and the Softie seat parachute fits perfectly into the
seat box once the seat cushion is removed. The parachute came with a 2-inch
pad which protects the bottom of the parachute from rubbing and also
provides just the right amount of height to sit on. Real comfortable too.

Good luck

justin

"ShawnD2112" wrote in message news:AnZDc.1369$Dq1.851@newsfe6-win...
Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D.

I fly a motor glider with a Paraphenalia Softie, with the "diaper
packed at the bottom" which is how my rigger calls packing it fatter
at the bottom and thinner at the top (as mentioned by an earlier
poster).

As others have recommended, talking to other Pitts owners is clearly a
good move, making sure to compare body sizes. Maybe one of them will
even lend you his chute to try out, on the ground at a minimum.

Other thoughts: My rigger installed an air bladder in the lower back
area that I can pump up for lower back support. Highly recommended. I
pump it, leave it for a while and release the pressure. A kind of slow
massage that seems to keep my back from getting stiff from being in
one position for many hours. Probably less of an issue in aerobatic
flying than soaring since you'll probably run out of fuel before your
back gets sore.

If you're in the San Francisco area -- and maybe even if you're not --
you ought to try Silver Parachute Sales. Alan Silver runs it and is an
excellent rigger who will treat you right both on initial sale and
repacking. He's based near the Hayward airport, just across the bay
from SFO. I know lots of glider pilots who send him their chutes for
repacking even though there are other, closer riggers. His telephone
is 510-785-7070.

Hope this helps and have fun with the Pitts.

Martin

I've been looking for a chute for my citabria - 7ECA. I spoke to Alan
Silver yesterday. He was very nice and explained alot to me about
chutes in the citabria. I'll need to modify my seat back to use a
backpack chute but it sounds worth it.

Some of you may have seen the ad's of pilot standing next to a
demolished citabria. He barely made it out. Alan told me that he had
trouble getting the door off. He pulled the hinger pins successfully
but didn't realize that he needed to push the bottom of the door out to
get it into the slip stream where it will be blown back. According to
Alan the guy had chosen to practice at around 6500AGL. He struggled
with the door for so long that if he had been even a few hundred feet
lower, he might not have made it. Scarey.

The reason he needed to get out was because part of the rear seat came
foward and fouled the rear stick.

I hope I got that story straight.

Dave
7ECA

Martin Hellman wrote:
"ShawnD2112" wrote in message news:AnZDc.1369$Dq1.851@newsfe6-win...

Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D.


I fly a motor glider with a Paraphenalia Softie, with the "diaper
packed at the bottom" which is how my rigger calls packing it fatter
at the bottom and thinner at the top (as mentioned by an earlier
poster).

As others have recommended, talking to other Pitts owners is clearly a
good move, making sure to compare body sizes. Maybe one of them will
even lend you his chute to try out, on the ground at a minimum.

Other thoughts: My rigger installed an air bladder in the lower back
area that I can pump up for lower back support. Highly recommended. I
pump it, leave it for a while and release the pressure. A kind of slow
massage that seems to keep my back from getting stiff from being in
one position for many hours. Probably less of an issue in aerobatic
flying than soaring since you'll probably run out of fuel before your
back gets sore.

If you're in the San Francisco area -- and maybe even if you're not --
you ought to try Silver Parachute Sales. Alan Silver runs it and is an
excellent rigger who will treat you right both on initial sale and
repacking. He's based near the Hayward airport, just across the bay
from SFO. I know lots of glider pilots who send him their chutes for
repacking even though there are other, closer riggers. His telephone
is 510-785-7070.

Hope this helps and have fun with the Pitts.

Martin

"ShawnD2112" wrote in message news:AnZDc.1369$Dq1.851@newsfe6-win...
Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D.

I've bought two new Butler seat packs four years ago that I use in my
S2-C. Happy with them. Would buy them again.

Doug Carter

How well do the seat packs work in the Pitts? While I have a cushion or two
under me, I didn't think there would be enough room for a seatpack chute.
Obviously I was wrong?

Cheers,
Shawn
"Doug Carter" wrote in message
om...
"ShawnD2112" wrote in message
news:AnZDc.1369$Dq1.851@newsfe6-win...
Was hoping to get a bit of expertise here. I'm in the market for an
emergency bailout chute for flying in my Pitts S-1D.

I've bought two new Butler seat packs four years ago that I use in my
S2-C. Happy with them. Would buy them again.

Doug Carter