Discus 2a vs Arcus @ 200km/h - EGC 2013

On Friday, July 19, 2013 3:01:00 PM UTC-7, wrote:
Cant be 100 % sure but that does not look like a Discus 2a wing tip.

Rolf

There are 3 generations of wingtips on the Discus 2
-no winglets (upturned wingtips)
-Masak winglets
-Maughmer winglets

Those look like the Maughmer winglets.
Craig R. / D2b driver

On Friday, 19 July 2013 18:58:35 UTC-7, Craig R. wrote:
On Friday, July 19, 2013 3:01:00 PM UTC-7, wrote:

Cant be 100 % sure but that does not look like a Discus 2a wing tip.



Rolf



There are 3 generations of wingtips on the Discus 2

-no winglets (upturned wingtips)

-Masak winglets

-Maughmer winglets



Those look like the Maughmer winglets.

Craig R. / D2b driver

Hard to see what speed they were doing or know what ballast level they were each using.

Flying a fully loaded LS8 against a fully loaded Arcus recently at Hobbs at 95-100kn I was definitely outperformed.

Sebastians D2a is 'slightly' better than a LS8 above 95kn, both full. (ask me how I know).

Nice to see a Std ship doing well but without more real information its hard to draw a hard conclusion relative to the Arcus.

2T

good

On 20/07/2013 07:19, Eric Greenwell wrote:
waremark wrote, On 7/19/2013 9:20 AM:
Thanks for the translation and the other info. As an Arcus owner I
was rather disappointed! Was the Discus flying in 15m or 18m mode? Do
we know how the wing loadings compared?

You don't buy a two seat, 20 meter glider for it's 200 kph performance.

If you're an owner who wants to enter it in the European Championships,
I'd say you probably did.

How fast would the Discus go with a 180 lb passenger?

Even faster! All that matters is the wing loading and the polar. At
that money, the Arcus should have as good a polar as the D2 - it's
nearly 20 years younger. It was probably flying at a higher wing
loading too.

GC

GC wrote, On 7/20/2013 7:14 AM:
On 20/07/2013 07:19, Eric Greenwell wrote:
waremark wrote, On 7/19/2013 9:20 AM:
Thanks for the translation and the other info. As an Arcus owner I
was rather disappointed! Was the Discus flying in 15m or 18m mode? Do
we know how the wing loadings compared?

You don't buy a two seat, 20 meter glider for it's 200 kph performance.

If you're an owner who wants to enter it in the European Championships,
I'd say you probably did.

How fast would the Discus go with a 180 lb passenger?

Even faster! All that matters is the wing loading and the polar. At
that money, the Arcus should have as good a polar as the D2 - it's
nearly 20 years younger. It was probably flying at a higher wing
loading too.

I didn't suggest adding 180 lbs, I suggested cramming two people into a
Discus. Surely you don't think two 180 pound people in a Discus would be
able to fly at all, much less faster than an Arcus? But to go with the
flow, it would not increase the wing loading, because you'd have to
remove 180 pounds of ballast. Contest rules, you know.

My I should have added a winking smiley face?

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm
http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

So right. The Arcus is a poor performer and anyone that bought one is probably feeling very taken advantage of and likely wants out just to avoid the continuing humiliation. Never mind the waste of money.

Being the helpful sort I am, I'll offer up $75K US to the first seller of a well kept example of the breed who just can't deal with it anymore. After all, that's about the asking price for a nice and much older D2 that can blow its gear doors off....

Waiting by the phone and wondering how on earth I'll ever get anyone to help me put it together at my local club....

-Evan Ludeman / T8

Don't worry about the help. I'll go halvsies with you.

P3 (just trying to help)

On Saturday, July 20, 2013 10:50:42 AM UTC-4, Evan Ludeman wrote:
So right. The Arcus is a poor performer and anyone that bought one is probably feeling very taken advantage of and likely wants out just to avoid the continuing humiliation. Never mind the waste of money.



Being the helpful sort I am, I'll offer up $75K US to the first seller of a well kept example of the breed who just can't deal with it anymore. After all, that's about the asking price for a nice and much older D2 that can blow its gear doors off....



Waiting by the phone and wondering how on earth I'll ever get anyone to help me put it together at my local club....



-Evan Ludeman / T8

T8 and P3 don't need an Arcus. I'll up it to $100k for the old dog, $125k if it can launch it's sad self.
Then perhaps I can get "the scoundrel" Michaud back in the air.
Jim

On Saturday, July 20, 2013 9:59:30 AM UTC-7, Papa3 wrote:
Don't worry about the help. I'll go halvsies with you.



P3 (just trying to help)



On Saturday, July 20, 2013 10:50:42 AM UTC-4, Evan Ludeman wrote:

So right. The Arcus is a poor performer and anyone that bought one is probably feeling very taken advantage of and likely wants out just to avoid the continuing humiliation. Never mind the waste of money.







Being the helpful sort I am, I'll offer up $75K US to the first seller of a well kept example of the breed who just can't deal with it anymore. After all, that's about the asking price for a nice and much older D2 that can blow its gear doors off....







Waiting by the phone and wondering how on earth I'll ever get anyone to help me put it together at my local club....







-Evan Ludeman / T8

105 Bid.

On Monday, July 22, 2013 12:51:01 PM UTC-4, JS wrote:
T8 and P3 don't need an Arcus. I'll up it to $100k for the old dog, $125k if it can launch it's sad self.

Then perhaps I can get "the scoundrel" Michaud back in the air.

Jim



On Saturday, July 20, 2013 9:59:30 AM UTC-7, Papa3 wrote:

Don't worry about the help. I'll go halvsies with you.







P3 (just trying to help)







On Saturday, July 20, 2013 10:50:42 AM UTC-4, Evan Ludeman wrote:



So right. The Arcus is a poor performer and anyone that bought one is probably feeling very taken advantage of and likely wants out just to avoid the continuing humiliation. Never mind the waste of money.















Being the helpful sort I am, I'll offer up $75K US to the first seller of a well kept example of the breed who just can't deal with it anymore. After all, that's about the asking price for a nice and much older D2 that can blow its gear doors off....















Waiting by the phone and wondering how on earth I'll ever get anyone to help me put it together at my local club....















-Evan Ludeman / T8

This video presents final glide of his Discus 2a wing to wing with

Arcus flying at 200km/h. As you can see at this speed performance

of 20m span glider is no better than 15m Discus 2a.


course not. the drag penalty for the extra span kills you at high speeds. when they slow down the arcus will walk away.