Aviation Videos, again...

Since you asked, I suggest you remove all aviation videos where someone is
injured or killed.

Jon

"Martin Hotze" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 25 Sep 2004 04:42:45 GMT, Jay Honeck wrote:

Quite honestly, the video page is there because I want it to exist, plain
and simple. There are many better ways to market a hotel, and we do
those,
too!

yes, right here.

get another domain and host your aviation stuff without too much linking
to
the hotel there. I guess then it would be much more appreciated by the
community.

Come on Martin, you are far from a usenet purist yourself, since you often
expouse your off topic views in this forum. So what if Jay is promoting his
business a little along with the aviation stuff? It's not like he is
promoting a porn site through an aviation newsgroup - the stuff is
relatively on target for the audience.


#m

--
Somehow, some way, the Left trash talks "multi-national corporations" and
"big corporations" as if they were messengers of evil, when, in fact,
corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital. (Jay Honeck in r.a.p.)

And, as long as we are talking off-topic...

I am a card carrying member of the left, and a confirmed capitalist who has
greatly benefited from building and selling companies. There is no
anti-corporate bias to left politics. On the other hand, to believe that
"corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital." is somewhat akin to believing in the tooth fairy.
Corporations can represent and be community assets within the confines of
responsible capitalism, or they can be money grubbing thoughtless polluters
and exploiters - it depends on management, not on the corporate entity or
the nature of capitalism.

On Sat, 25 Sep 2004 17:37:07 GMT, Michael 182 wrote:

Quite honestly, the video page is there because I want it to exist, plain
and simple. There are many better ways to market a hotel, and we do
those,
too!

yes, right here.

get another domain and host your aviation stuff without too much linking
to
the hotel there. I guess then it would be much more appreciated by the
community.

Come on Martin, you are far from a usenet purist yourself, since you often
expouse your off topic views in this forum.

agreed (on the off topic postings; but I must say that this only happens
here)

So what if Jay is promoting his
business a little along with the aviation stuff? It's not like he is
promoting a porn site through an aviation newsgroup - the stuff is
relatively on target for the audience.

there are many others here that have aviation related businesses, but they
don't promote their stuff in such a way like Jay does. besides: the domain
will cost him about $10 to $20/year.

--
^^^^^^^
you know what this is? this is a signature seperator. a 4 line signature is
widely accepted on usenet and can contain whatever offtopic you want.

Somehow, some way, the Left trash talks "multi-national corporations" and
"big corporations" as if they were messengers of evil, when, in fact,
corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital. (Jay Honeck in r.a.p.)

And, as long as we are talking off-topic...

I am a card carrying member of the left, and a confirmed capitalist who has
greatly benefited from building and selling companies. There is no
anti-corporate bias to left politics. On the other hand, to believe that
"corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital." is somewhat akin to believing in the tooth fairy.

I .sig'ed this sentence (it is from Jay) because it is funny. at least for
me. :-)

#m

--
Somehow, some way, the Left trash talks "multi-national corporations" and
"big corporations" as if they were messengers of evil, when, in fact,
corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital. (Jay Honeck in r.a.p.)

"Martin Hotze" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 25 Sep 2004 17:37:07 GMT, Michael 182 wrote:

Quite honestly, the video page is there because I want it to exist,
plain
and simple. There are many better ways to market a hotel, and we do
those,
too!

yes, right here.

get another domain and host your aviation stuff without too much linking
to
the hotel there. I guess then it would be much more appreciated by the
community.

Come on Martin, you are far from a usenet purist yourself, since you often
expouse your off topic views in this forum.

agreed (on the off topic postings; but I must say that this only happens
here)

So what if Jay is promoting his
business a little along with the aviation stuff? It's not like he is
promoting a porn site through an aviation newsgroup - the stuff is
relatively on target for the audience.

there are many others here that have aviation related businesses, but they
don't promote their stuff in such a way like Jay does. besides: the domain
will cost him about $10 to $20/year.

--
^^^^^^^
you know what this is? this is a signature seperator. a 4 line signature
is
widely accepted on usenet and can contain whatever offtopic you want.

Never knew that, thx


Somehow, some way, the Left trash talks "multi-national corporations"
and
"big corporations" as if they were messengers of evil, when, in fact,
corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital. (Jay Honeck in r.a.p.)

And, as long as we are talking off-topic...

I am a card carrying member of the left, and a confirmed capitalist who
has
greatly benefited from building and selling companies. There is no
anti-corporate bias to left politics. On the other hand, to believe that
"corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital." is somewhat akin to believing in the tooth fairy.

I .sig'ed this sentence (it is from Jay) because it is funny. at least for
me. :-)

yeah, I knew that - was just responding to Jay, third hand, I guess...


#m

--
Somehow, some way, the Left trash talks "multi-national corporations" and
"big corporations" as if they were messengers of evil, when, in fact,
corporations represent the ultimate, perfect expression of communal
ownership of capital. (Jay Honeck in r.a.p.)

As for Honek; I appreciate his efforts to clean up his page on crash
videos. He did remove the word "enjoy", which I personally appreciated
since it was one of my friends dying in one of those videos.
Contrary to what you have stated about me repeatedly, I have no
objection at all to crash video being viewed in the right context. That
context is simply totally safety related and presented to a pilot
audience in a format that doesn't have an opening link that says "COOL
STUFF".

One thing to note: Our aviation video page does NOT link directly
to/from the "Cool Stuff" menu. Rather, it links directly to a menu
choice called, not surprisingly, "Aviation Videos."

This page, in turn, links back to the main homepage menu item of "Cool
Stuff" -- which is a catch-all menu choice, to a page with lots of
things on it, including:

- The Rec.Avation "Rogue's Gallery"
- Recent Events at the Inn
- A web-cam view of Iowa City
- Pictures of our aviation-themed stained glass windows
- A history of the Inn
- A list of fly-in aviation museums
- The aviation video page.

(See it for yourself here" www.alexisparkinn.com/cool_stuff.htm )

So it's not like you click on "Cool Stuff" and go directly to aviation
carnage, as you frequently seem to imply.

I suppose I could change the main menu item name to something else,
but, quite frankly, I can't think of another "catch-all" 2-word phrase
that sums up everything on that menu page so succinctly as "Cool
Stuff".
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Here is another spin on this subject...
I wish there was a video of a friend of mine crashing and burning to death.
What he did was stupid.
I would show that video to any pilot that ever thought about doing low
level aerobatics, and I would tell them how stupid it is and why.
My friend was an Advanced category competition aerobatic pilot. He knew
better, but he did it anyway.
He was showing off for people who were not going to be impressed with
what he attempted to do.
He did it because of ego.
That's what killed him.

Hilton wrote:
Since you conveniently deleted the rest of my post, for completeness, here
it is: "Now, don't get me wrong, I don't see anything wrong putting a video
resource on your website, it's just the false pretence of 'education' that
just doesn't seem right/true."

john smith wrote:

Here is another spin on this subject...
I wish there was a video of a friend of mine crashing and burning to death.
What he did was stupid.
I would show that video to any pilot that ever thought about doing low
level aerobatics, and I would tell them how stupid it is and why.

Hey John..... What does his widow and children think of that idea.

And if it was you who had crashed and burned what do you think
your wife and children would think of someone just like you
( or Jay ) showing that video over and over and over and over.

Perhaps on a commercial website for a motel..... just like Jays.

If someone caught your daughter on tape doing something really stupid
like running out onto the street without looking, and the tape clearly
showed your daughter being hit and thrown fifty feet to her death, are
you telling the group here that you would like to see that tape being
shown over and over again on the web or reality TV shows and on
websites like Jay Honecks - Which by the way is a website for a motel.

And if the answer is truly yes then would you mind having your wife
append a few comments of her own before you hit the post button.

I for one would be very interesting in reading your wifes comments
on that subject.

Perhaps on a commercial website for a motel..... just like Jays.

Just to clear up this point: Calling it a "commercial website" implies that
we make money when the videos are viewed.

We do not.

And, before you even think it, I have yet to meet a guest who has listed our
"aviation video page" as the "place they first heard about the inn..."

That's not what this page is all about, and I certainly don't expect people
to visit the inn because of it.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Stay on topic, Shiver.
The subject is relevance.
Is there something that can be learned from viewing an aviation accident
video? I have been involved with competition aerobatics for over 20
years. On average, I lose two or three friends/acqaintances each year
due to mishaps/accidents. I'm neither happy nor proud of that fact. To
those unfamiliar with the sport, it looks dangerous.
Almost all of these mishaps/accidents were preventable.
In the case of my friend's crash, another friend was killed in an acro
crash less than a year later. This individual was very upset at the
funeral for our friend. His crash, too, was preventable and the result
of doing something stupid, that he knew better than to do, but he did it
anyway. Both crashes, I won't call them accidents, were the result of
insufficient altitude for the maneuver attempted.
Secondly, there are many webhosts who provide space to offer content
unrelated to the primary purpose of the website. They provide a service.
When I view the aviation content on Jay's website, I don't care that the
purpose of the homepage is commercial operation. I'm there for the
aviation stuff.

Shiver Me Timbers wrote:
john smith wrote:
Here is another spin on this subject...
I wish there was a video of a friend of mine crashing and burning to death.
What he did was stupid.
I would show that video to any pilot that ever thought about doing low
level aerobatics, and I would tell them how stupid it is and why.


Hey John..... What does his widow and children think of that idea.
And if it was you who had crashed and burned what do you think
your wife and children would think of someone just like you
( or Jay ) showing that video over and over and over and over.
Perhaps on a commercial website for a motel..... just like Jays.
If someone caught your daughter on tape doing something really stupid
like running out onto the street without looking, and the tape clearly
showed your daughter being hit and thrown fifty feet to her death, are
you telling the group here that you would like to see that tape being
shown over and over again on the web or reality TV shows and on
websites like Jay Honecks - Which by the way is a website for a motel.
And if the answer is truly yes then would you mind having your wife
append a few comments of her own before you hit the post button.
I for one would be very interesting in reading your wifes comments
on that subject.

Since you asked, I suggest you remove all aviation videos where someone is
injured or killed.

Thanks for the suggestion.

I've given this some serious thought, ever since Dudley and others took such
great offense. Although I understand the nature of your statement , I
simply don't agree that removing bad accident videos from the site is a good
idea. Here's why:

All of the videos -- save one -- are totally anonymous. There are no names
listed, and -- in many cases -- not even a location given. Thus, no
families can be embarrassed or cast in a bad light.

Ironically, the only one this isn't true of is the B-52 fatal crash video,
which contains links to extensive safety-related commentary in which the
pilot is named -- and blamed -- over and over again.

It's the B-52 crash that probably has the most to teach us all, with its sad
story of ego, over-confidence, and the defying of common sense (not to
mention basic aerodynamics) and logic. And while it's true that most of us
won't ever fly an 8-engine jet bomber, we can all learn from the strange mix
of attitude and circumstances that caused the deaths of several good men.

In short, if I truly want this page to be more than just a place to watch
planes crash, the bad wrecks mustn't be eliminated.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"