Plane crashed -- what happened?

Neil Gould wrote:

IÂ*don'tÂ*haveÂ*muchÂ*nightÂ*flyingÂ*experience. Â*OnÂ*theÂ*eastÂ*coast,
it'sÂ*notÂ*easyÂ*toÂ*seeÂ*placesÂ*thatÂ*farÂ*out Â*atÂ*night...Â*but
that'sÂ*mostlyÂ*dueÂ*toÂ*allÂ*theÂ*lightsÂ*onÂ*t heÂ*ground!

You may be able to see them, but not discern the airport from the other
lights. The tower lights may be more easy to find.

As Neil wrote earlier in his note, it is often possible to spot the traffic
using the airport before the airport. I'd that experience recently
approaching Albany: I didn't see the airport, but I did see traffic lined
up on final. Follow the line drawn by the traffic...and there's the
airport.

The rotating beacon (if that's what you mean by "tower light") I find much
more difficult to spot. The flash frequency is so low that one really
needs to be looking at the same spot for a while to catch it. Plus, if
there's any civilization there are plenty of other lights flashing about.

I'll occasionally think I see a tower only to realize it's a curve in a road
(with headlights "flashing" me as cars drive the curve).

- Andrew

Andrew Gideon wrote:

The flash frequency is so low that one really
needs to be looking at the same spot for a while to catch it.

And, be sure to look to the left or the right of where you think the beacon
will be since it is the rods of the eyes that will detect the beacon easier
at night.

--
Peter













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"Dan Luke" wrote in message
...

"Dan Foster" wrote:
Not so sure it's necessarily plane's fault like the family and friends
seems to think -- odds in general aviation are pretty good that it's
often human error somewhere in the chain.

Sorry for the loss of your friend.

Could have been just about any of the things you mention, or a
combination of several; we may never know, of course.

Still, if I were betting, my money would be on simple spatial
disorientation as the cause. Very easy to lose one's bearings over
water at night, even when it's good VMC.

The so-called "Black Hole Approach".

http://www.avweb.com/news/airman/182402-1.html



Even over land, one can get out of shape from visual illusions very
easily.

Dan,

My condolences to your friend.

You've laid out a very long list of "What Ifs" but it's almost impossible to
say. It could be one or a combination of several factors which culminated in
an accident.

Flying can be unforgiving. Night flying even more so and night over water
with little or no landmarks / horizon is maybe the most unforgiving of all.

I hope you eventually get the answers you seek.

Peace,

Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

That's tough. I also lost a friend at night. He was over the desert and
just didn't know how low he was.

Another good possibility in your friend's case is that he started a
decent without realizing how low he was. At night, it can be hard.

ANother possibility is that he got disoriented. Many VFR pilots are
surprised that flying over the water at night really is the same as
IMC. You really can get disoriented. In fact, the FAA even allows you
to log actual instrument time when flying over water at night even when
the weather is perfect.

-Robert, CFI

Can you send the link for the NTSB initial report ("factual")? Or at
least, the date or tail number of the airplane?

Thanks,
John Clonts
Temple, Texas
N7NZ

"John Clonts" wrote in message
oups.com...
Can you send the link for the NTSB initial report ("factual")? Or at
least, the date or tail number of the airplane?

Thanks,
John Clonts
Temple, Texas
N7NZ


http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/AccList.asp?month=2&year=2005

Avery Glasair? These preliminary reports are supposed to be updated daily
but they are not.

In article .com, John Clonts wrote:
Can you send the link for the NTSB initial report ("factual")? Or at
least, the date or tail number of the airplane?

Sure.

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...25X00234&key=1

-Dan

"Matt Barrow" wrote:
The so-called "Black Hole Approach".

http://www.avweb.com/news/airman/182402-1.html

Maybe, as in http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...15X02030&key=1

Either that or a JFK-type loss of control.
--
Dan
C-172RG at BFM

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
ups.com...
That's tough. I also lost a friend at night. He was over the desert and
just didn't know how low he was.

Another good possibility in your friend's case is that he started a
decent without realizing how low he was. At night, it can be hard.

ANother possibility is that he got disoriented. Many VFR pilots are
surprised that flying over the water at night really is the same as
IMC. You really can get disoriented. In fact, the FAA even allows you
to log actual instrument time when flying over water at night even when
the weather is perfect.

-Robert, CFI


That's Interesting, About logging IFR at night over water would you still
need a Safety pilot?