Total electrical failure - (hypothetical)

David Rind wrote:
Why stop at 500 MSL, though? This seems like pretty much your last out.
Why not descend until you can see the water

I don't really have a good answer to that. At some point I guess you're
down to picking the least of several evils.

In article , Roy Smith
wrote:

David Rind wrote:
Why stop at 500 MSL, though? This seems like pretty much your last out.
Why not descend until you can see the water

I don't really have a good answer to that. At some point I guess you're
down to picking the least of several evils.

Have you ever read "Flying South" by Barbara Cushman Rowell? There's an
amazing story in there about flying up along the coast of Brazil at
100' MSL in the fog, a VFR pilot, trying to keep the coastline in sight
and find a place to land before she got lost in the fog.

"David Rind" wrote in message
...
Roy Smith wrote:
Living near the coast (and a flat coastline too), I've often figured
in such a situation I'd dead-reckon out over the ocean, do a blind
letdown as low as I dared (500 MSL?) and hope I broke out. Then
scud-run back to land and hope I could find a coastal airport by
pilotage before I got run over by a jet. Or maybe land on the beach.

That's always been my idea of a final backup plan as well. (Total
electrical failure at the same time my handheld GPS fails seems pretty
unlikely, but you never know.) Why stop at 500 MSL, though? This seems
like pretty much your last out. Why not descend until you can see the
water (which, if you are really unlucky yet a third time on this flight,
will be when it hits your windshield). Unless you have some expectation
that you can stay up until the clouds break, what other choice is there?

From what I've read, this was standard technique in the early days of the
trans-Atlantic flying boats. I can't recall the title but I remember one
such story that had them dropping down at night to under 100' and turning
the landing lights on so they could see the ocean, in a big 4-engine flying
boat no less. Now that's scud running.

-cwk.

"Roy Smith" wrote in message
...

Living near the coast (and a flat coastline too), I've often figured
in such a situation I'd dead-reckon out over the ocean, do a blind
letdown as low as I dared (500 MSL?) and hope I broke out. Then
scud-run back to land and hope I could find a coastal airport by
pilotage before I got run over by a jet. Or maybe land on the beach.

Well, as long as the coast is flat, it is day, and the weather does not get
worse at the coastline, maybe. So you land on the beach, which sounds best
to me, but suppose you are forced to land in someplace not so suitable and
you damage the plane and perhaps yourself? Now you are a long way off course
and nobody has any idea where to look for you.

"C J Campbell" wrote in message
...

"Roy Smith" wrote in message
...

Living near the coast (and a flat coastline too), I've often figured
in such a situation I'd dead-reckon out over the ocean, do a blind
letdown as low as I dared (500 MSL?) and hope I broke out. Then
scud-run back to land and hope I could find a coastal airport by
pilotage before I got run over by a jet. Or maybe land on the beach.

Well, as long as the coast is flat, it is day, and the weather does not
get
worse at the coastline, maybe. So you land on the beach, which sounds best
to me, but suppose you are forced to land in someplace not so suitable and
you damage the plane and perhaps yourself? Now you are a long way off
course
and nobody has any idea where to look for you.



Now the only question is, do you have a beautiful woman with you, or not?

" wrote in message
...

Well, as long as the coast is flat, it is day, and the weather does not
get
worse at the coastline, maybe. So you land on the beach, which sounds
best
to me, but suppose you are forced to land in someplace not so suitable
and
you damage the plane and perhaps yourself? Now you are a long way off
course
and nobody has any idea where to look for you.



Now the only question is, do you have a beautiful woman with you, or not?

Generally not. She hates to fly.

I have had a total electrical failure. It was night, but fortunately
not IMC.

That experience got me to rethink my IFR cockpit mgmt techniques.
Having a GPS and handheld radio are not enough. The GPS needs to be
turned on and tracking sats. The handheld needs to be easily
accessible (think map pocket) vs. in a flight bag in the backseat.
Jacks to easily plug the headset to the handheld COM are a must.

Also handheld COMs have terrible transmission/reception due to their
small antenna. Expect no more than a few miles. Many people put an
antenna splitter off the main COM antenna to an empty cable
specifically to be connected to the handheld in this event.

-Nathan



On 17 Mar 2005 07:05:22 -0800, "paul kgyy"
wrote:

I was doing some practice IFR at home last night with my simulator, and
set up for random failures. First thing that happened was complete
electrical shut down - no radios, no VOR, no Xponder, and it suddenly
occurred to me that I'd never thought through what I would do. I do
carry backup comm and gps but what if those batteries were also dead,
and I'm in IMC? I know where I am, but there's no way that I can
continue on course for very long. There seem to be only 2 options, and
both involve finding VFR (go down if ceilings permit, or head for
nearest VFR laterally), but both involve flying off course/altitude in
cloud without a working transponder.

I'd appreciate some insight from the group.

Thanks to everybody. I do in fact carry portable gps and have it
operational in flight, portable comm with external antenna and
headphone adaptor, and extra batteries. Since my hope port KGYY is on
the border of Lake Michigan, if I'm near the lake and need VFR one
option is to stay clear of the STARs and DPs and scud run if I can
expect 1000 feet or so.

Bad events often don't come in groups of 1.

My Garmin 296 will run for 15 hours after losing power from the
aircraft.

You mean, you will *ever* depart IFR without spare batteries for your
handheld GPS? I usually carry two sets of spare batteries.


paul kgyy wrote:
I was doing some practice IFR at home last night with my simulator,
and
set up for random failures. First thing that happened was complete
electrical shut down - no radios, no VOR, no Xponder, and it suddenly
occurred to me that I'd never thought through what I would do. I do
carry backup comm and gps but what if those batteries were also dead,
and I'm in IMC? I know where I am, but there's no way that I can
continue on course for very long. There seem to be only 2 options,
and
both involve finding VFR (go down if ceilings permit, or head for
nearest VFR laterally), but both involve flying off course/altitude
in
cloud without a working transponder.

I'd appreciate some insight from the group.