Go around, NOW!!

"Newps" wrote in message
...
And if the pilot would have landed and caused a loss of separation the
FAA would have hammered that facility for only having one controller
working. After that reaming if it would have been me I would have had
my passenger say "kiss my ass".

I've been wondering about the "second" controller. It's always been my
understanding that there is supposed to be 2 on duty, every controll tower
I've ever visited always had at least 2. Although at that particular time,
he only had 2 aircraft in the air, he was also talking to me and the fellow
behind me on the ground, a guy on clearance delivery, and a helicopter
inbound. I never heard the "second" controllers voice. Maybe #2 was taking
a #2?

Jim

"Piper 1234, when you hear another pilot call for an IFR
clearance on Ground Control (GC and CD are the same freq at KLZU) and I give
that pilot his clearance, it would be nice if you'd give him time to write
it down, read it back, and get confirmation before you interrupt him with
your taxi request!"

Why?

Often when I get an IFR clearance it is long and involved. The other
guy would have to wait (with his hobbs running) while I read it back and
get a confirmation. OTOH taxi instructions are generally pretty short
(taxi 26 via charlie) and wouldn't cause a problem should another
aircraft slip in. He could be on his way while I'm getting the charts out.

r.a.s trimmed
Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Michael wrote:
the tower - calmly and professionally. Every time a controller is
chewing out someone on the frequency, he is screwing up - and usually
it's not his first screwup either. He's mad because he knows he didn't
do a good job with the situation, and he's taking it out on the pilot.

But isn't this true of any situation? I've noticed road rage, nasty
people in parking lots, softball fields, etc. And the one being
hostile is always the one who is wrong -- and they probably realize
it and refuse to deal with it in a rational manner.

I think the controller was waiting and expecting the IFR pilot to read back
the clearance. If the IFR pilot was unable to do so promptly, he should
have told the controller to "stand-by", he didn't say stand-by, but he
didn't immediately read back the clearance either. Again, I think several
people created that problem, I think that the pilot requesting taxi
instructions was unaware that CD was also on the same freq, and didn't have
a clue as to what the controller was giving the IFR pilot and that the IFR
pilot was expected to read back the clearance but hesitated. That's just
how it sounded to me at the time, I may be wrong.
Jim

"Jose" wrote in message
. com...
"Piper 1234, when you hear another pilot call for an IFR
clearance on Ground Control (GC and CD are the same freq at KLZU) and I
give
that pilot his clearance, it would be nice if you'd give him time to
write
it down, read it back, and get confirmation before you interrupt him
with
your taxi request!"

Why?

Often when I get an IFR clearance it is long and involved. The other
guy would have to wait (with his hobbs running) while I read it back and
get a confirmation. OTOH taxi instructions are generally pretty short
(taxi 26 via charlie) and wouldn't cause a problem should another
aircraft slip in. He could be on his way while I'm getting the charts
out.

r.a.s trimmed
Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Matt Whiting wrote:
Steve Foley wrote:

The best one I heard was on the scanner at Oshkosh. The controller
announced:

All aircraft on final, we are using runway 27. Please look at your
magnetic
compass. If it reads 9, please break off your approach. That was the
last he
said about it.


I understand that only the best controllers get selected for OSH duty

No. Anybody from the Great Lakes region, and only that region, is
eligible. That's the only criteria.

Jim Burns wrote:



I've been wondering about the "second" controller. It's always been my
understanding that there is supposed to be 2 on duty, every controll tower
I've ever visited always had at least 2.

The number depends on how much traffic can be expected at a given time
of day and how many people are on duty. There's nothing worse for a
tower manager and his supervisors than to have something happen and the
investigation reveals controllers on the couch.


Although at that particular time,
he only had 2 aircraft in the air, he was also talking to me and the fellow
behind me on the ground, a guy on clearance delivery, and a helicopter
inbound. I never heard the "second" controllers voice. Maybe #2 was taking
a #2?

What time of day?

I think that the pilot requesting taxi
instructions was unaware that CD was also on the same freq

....which brings up another pet peeve - controllers who use both
frequencies to broadcast on. I'm on tower and hearing a lot of ground
radio traffic, I turn to ground and hear the same ground traffic, and
can't get a word in edgewise. So my motor's running at the threshold
while three airplanes are taxiied into place, two aircraft get IFR
clearances and a reroute... what's a pilot to do?

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

11:00am Sunday morning

"Newps" wrote in message
...


Jim Burns wrote:



I've been wondering about the "second" controller. It's always been my
understanding that there is supposed to be 2 on duty, every controll
tower
I've ever visited always had at least 2.

The number depends on how much traffic can be expected at a given time
of day and how many people are on duty. There's nothing worse for a
tower manager and his supervisors than to have something happen and the
investigation reveals controllers on the couch.


Although at that particular time,
he only had 2 aircraft in the air, he was also talking to me and the
fellow
behind me on the ground, a guy on clearance delivery, and a helicopter
inbound. I never heard the "second" controllers voice. Maybe #2 was
taking
a #2?

What time of day?

"Jim Burns" wrote in message
...

Although he sounded rude it was obvious he wasn't having a good day and at
the very least had his hands full, I'm just curious about what standard
procedures are for tower controllers

He did not just sound rude. He was rude. The standard procedure is to behave
in a professional manner. This guy lost it, has lost it before, and is
likely to do it again.

I would not be surprised if he vectored the Cessna to the wrong runway in
the first place.

what 'i've been told to do is to call the tower later and ask a
supervisor to listen to the tape. i know of at least one case where
that was done with satisfactory results. counselling and retraining of
the controller. no fighting, no accusations or threats...just have 'em
listen to the tape.

dan