Commercial rating?

So if I had a float plane and wanted to offer to fly people and stuff out
to lake bound cottages, I'd need to set myself up as a Part 135 operation?

Yes, you would have to be 135 to charge people to fly them places.
You'd also have to be married to an insurance company CEO.

How about my previous question about doing photography?

Photography is fine. You can be paid to take pictures as a commercial
pilot. In fact, our Sacramento FSDO has said that private pilots may be
paid to take pictures themselves as long as they are working directly
for the end customer (i.e. not employed by an aerial survey company). I
think the FSDO is wrong on that but they are the ones to enforce
anything. You can also tow banners etc. In reality, those jobs are not
plentiful though.

-Robert

A salesman may demo his airplane (consignment) but a private
pilot may not be hired to do the demo.

Is that an understanding from the FAA? That sounds unlikely. The
definition of salesman shouldn't be limited to someone selling
something he personally owns. I understand this to mean a private pilot
may work for an aircraft broker and receive a salery or commision for
selling the plane, including taking the customer for a ride. This seems
to be an explicit exemption for the "incidental" rule for private
pilots flying for their employeers.

-Robert

Paul Tomblin wrote:
- Is adding a commercial rating one of the things that non-citizens need
Homeland Security/TSA approval for?

Paul - your situation sounds identical to mine.

I posed this question to AOPA and was told that NO TSA security check
is required for the Commercial. Only the initial Private/Sport
Certificate, IFR Rating, and Multi Engine Ratings require TSA approval.

I have started my training at a Part 141 school, and have completed my
complex endorsement over this past weekend, and had no questions at all
about citizenship or TSA security checks. My coworker, a US Citizen,
recently did his multi at the same school and had to provide
passport/ID to prove his citizenship.

Rich

You can do photo work, as long as you are the photographer,
but if a photographer wants to hire you, you need the 135
certificate. There are some allowances for distance (radius
of action) and you can't land anywhere but the airport of
departure.

Yes, to fly people or cargo to other places, you must have
the 135 certificate.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Paul Tomblin" wrote in message
...
| In a previous article, "Peter Duniho"
said:
| condition for carrying passengers or cargo for hire.
That's actually
| slightly inaccurate, because there are some narrow
exceptions, but generally
| speaking carriage of passengers or cargo for hire
requires not only a
| commercial certificate, but compliance with other
regulations (Parts 119 and
| 135, as Bob mentions, are the most common ones to run
into, though you could
| of course do it under Part 121 as well).
|
| So if I had a float plane and wanted to offer to fly
people and stuff out
| to lake bound cottages, I'd need to set myself up as a
Part 135 operation?
|
| How about my previous question about doing photography?
Can I take farm
| photographs, or do photogrammetry surveys? How about
artistic pictures?
|
| --
| Paul Tomblin
http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
| As convenient as it is for information to come to us,
libraries do have a
| valuable side effect: they force all of the smart people
to come together in
| one place where they can interact with one another. --
Neal Stephenson

We are correct. A salesman with only a PPL and 200 hours
may demo an airplane in flight to a customer, the purpose of
the flight is a sale, not a trip, even though it may involve
a trip. But the salesman cannot hire a PPL to fly the demo,
even if the only pay is the flight time.

Consignment means that the salesman has control of the
operation of the airplane even though he does not own or
hold title.

A brand new CPL with 200 hours from an approved school [250
hours otherwise] may not be a PIC under 135, but under part
91, that pilot may be hired to do ferry, spotting, or to fly
your airplane for your private purposes.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
oups.com...
| A salesman may demo his airplane (consignment) but a
private
| pilot may not be hired to do the demo.
|
| Is that an understanding from the FAA? That sounds
unlikely. The
| definition of salesman shouldn't be limited to someone
selling
| something he personally owns. I understand this to mean a
private pilot
| may work for an aircraft broker and receive a salery or
commision for
| selling the plane, including taking the customer for a
ride. This seems
| to be an explicit exemption for the "incidental" rule for
private
| pilots flying for their employeers.
|
| -Robert
|

the FAA has said that merely
putting a notice on a bulletin board is holding out. The rationale is that
the uninformed public needs some assurance...

This is not a good justification. The uninformed public needs to be
informed. This can be accomplished by requiring that any offer of
flight clearly state that one is (or is not) a private pilot who does
not meet the regulations for paying commercial flight, and/or is flying
a private aircraft which is not maintained to commercial standards.

Don't you feel safer knowing that
the captain of your airline flight has...

Not relevant, and I doubt the public knows what the airline captain has
gone through. And I believe that the uninformed public does know the
difference between an airline flight and a private airplane flight.

I think the FAA has gone way overboard on this, and has cut out some
excellent ways to boost GA (for example, putting an offer of flying home
on the same bulletin board as offers for driving home from college)

People putting offers to drive home from college are not livery drivers,
and probably have had their license for only a few years.

Jose
--
Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

However, generally speaking if a pilot demonstrates a
willingness to fly the general public, they are "holding out".

And getting known for offering to fly people hanging around the airport
fence demonstrates a willingness to fly the general public.

Jose
--
Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

I posed this question to AOPA and was told that NO TSA security check is required for the Commercial.

Hey, it looks like you are right on that. The only restriction appears
to be that it must be only for single engine, mutliengine training for
any level requires TSA approval.
http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/pdf91/310342_web.pdf

-Robert

Paul Tomblin wrote:

So if I had a float plane and wanted to offer to fly people and stuff out
to lake bound cottages, I'd need to set myself up as a Part 135 operation?

yes. Unless your passenger owns the aircraft and hires you to do the
flying.


How about my previous question about doing photography? Can I take farm
photographs, or do photogrammetry surveys? How about artistic pictures?


sight seeing within 25 miles and aerial photography can be conducted
under part 91. See 14 CFR 119.1(e).

The whole thing is a bit confusing, and these are quite typically the
kind of questions you should expect during the oral part of the
checkride :-)

To get back to the original question, prepare the written, and by the
time you have taken it, you should know the answers to all these
questions ;-)

--Sylvain

Jim Macklin wrote:

You can do photo work, as long as you are the photographer,

actually this is incorrect. aerial photography, along with
other things like ferry flights, crop dusting, banner towing,
firefighting, etc. are the kind of aerial work a commercial
pilot can engage in. The 25 miles radius things are for sight
seeing flight (hint: suggest your sight seeing customers to
bring a camera and then it becomes an aerial photography flight :-)

--Sylvain