Airspace Violations OLC

Marc Ramsey wrote:
5Z wrote:
It's up to ALL OF US to keep an eye on flight claims and attempt to
contact the person making a questionable claim. Ask them to add a
comment to the flight explaining the discrepancy, or withdraw the
flight. If they refuse, and it's an obvious bust, then submit a
"complaint" to the OLC.

The very concept of getting accusatory emails from individuals who
likely know nothing of the circumstances of my flights, would certainly
kill any interest I might have in participating in the OLC...


How about calling in law enforcement to carry out random ramp testing
on loggers? Once folks start breaking one or two little rules, who
knows where it could lead? We need to stamp out this antisocial
widespread glider log cheating immediately!

Some good examples - all of those recent long ridge flights in the NE
USA are made WAY too close to the ground. I think all those logs
should be pulled for close scrutiny for violations!

Mike

Marc Ramsey wrote:
5Z wrote:
It's up to ALL OF US to keep an eye on flight claims and attempt to
contact the person making a questionable claim. Ask them to add a
comment to the flight explaining the discrepancy, or withdraw the
flight. If they refuse, and it's an obvious bust, then submit a
"complaint" to the OLC.

The very concept of getting accusatory emails from individuals who
likely know nothing of the circumstances of my flights, would certainly
kill any interest I might have in participating in the OLC...

I can understand that, but is there a way a person could contact you
that would be agreeable to you? Or as an alternative to people
contacting a pilot with a potential airspace violation, would you prefer
any pilot posting a flight with an airspace intrusion explain why the
intrusion was allowed (in the comment section on the claim form)?

--
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA

www.motorglider.org - Download "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane
Operation"

Eric Greenwell wrote:
Marc Ramsey wrote:
The very concept of getting accusatory emails from individuals who
likely know nothing of the circumstances of my flights, would
certainly kill any interest I might have in participating in the OLC...

I can understand that, but is there a way a person could contact you
that would be agreeable to you? Or as an alternative to people
contacting a pilot with a potential airspace violation, would you prefer
any pilot posting a flight with an airspace intrusion explain why the
intrusion was allowed (in the comment section on the claim form)?

I might not have an issue with the OLC implementing some mechanism for
automatically detecting and requesting clarification on any apparent
airspace violations in a flight. It may or may not be worth the hassle,
but it would at least be clear what was going on. If I instead had to
justify my every move to arbitrary observers, it definitely isn't worth
it. Every year I make flights under (and once inside, with permission)
Class B airspace, over and inside of (with permission) Class C airspace,
over and inside of (inactive) Restricted airspace, in Class A wave
windows, etc. A local pilot may or may not understand what is going on,
someone outside of the area almost certainly won't.

For some people, it would just be a license to harass other pilots.
This is one area where personal responsibility should be the primary
enforcement mechanism, just as it is for those who aren't participating
in the OLC.

Marc

P.S. I'm not currently participating in the OLC, as I don't think it is
worth the hassle...

When someone passes you on the highway doing 15 over the speed limit,
do you call 911 and sic the coppers on him? If you see your neighbor
in a sleazy bar about to get lucky, do you call his wife?

The saying "Mind your own business" comes to mind!

Kirk
66

When someone passes me doing 80 in a 65 zone, I do call the cops.

Mike Schumann

wrote in message
ups.com...
When someone passes you on the highway doing 15 over the speed limit,
do you call 911 and sic the coppers on him? If you see your neighbor
in a sleazy bar about to get lucky, do you call his wife?

The saying "Mind your own business" comes to mind!

Kirk
66

When someone passes you on the highway doing 15 over the speed limit,
do you call 911 and sic the coppers on him?

15 KPH we have speed cameras and radar and lidar for that!

If you see your neighbour
in a sleazy bar about to get lucky, do you call his wife?

I don't hang out in sleazy bars do you!

As a former PI the wife normally paid to find out they called me.

The saying "Mind your own business" comes to mind!

Yes just like the USA minding everyone else's business the world police.

Next time a jet on descent into Australia's busiest airport sucks a glider
through its engine don't forget to dial 000

Kirk
66

wrote:

The saying "Mind your own business" comes to mind!

Airspace violations *are* my business when they cause the authorities to
enlarge that class C airspace for another 10 miles just for safety
because gliders are known not to respect airspace boundaries.

Airspace violations *are* my business when they cause ATC not to grant
me a clearance because gliders are known not to adhere to clearances.

Airspace violations *are* my business when I sit in that airliner which
hits the offending glider.

etc.

Stefan

Sit back and take a deep breath!

What you are talking about are POTENTIAL airspace violations, not
PROVEN airspace violations. I have been routinely cleared thru Class B
airspace. We also have restricted airspace close by that is open to the
public on a given day (or hour), or is restricted in subsections, or is
restricted to a certain altitude. You simply can't tell if there has
been an ACTUAL violation unless you know all the particulars about the
situation. For that reason alone OLC has no business being in the air
cop business.

MOOYMMV.

Tom Seim
Richland, WA

Stefan wrote:

Airspace violations *are* my business when they cause the authorities to
enlarge that class C airspace for another 10 miles just for safety
because gliders are known not to respect airspace boundaries.

Airspace violations *are* my business when they cause ATC not to grant
me a clearance because gliders are known not to adhere to clearances.

Airspace violations *are* my business when I sit in that airliner which
hits the offending glider.

And all these things have happened to you?

Have you compared the number of violations by the mythical "Piper Cub"
which happen every year to the number of violations by gliders? Have you
examined the faulty logic in advocating an expansion of airspace that is
not respected?

You also sincerely advocate the mandatory installation of transponders
in ALL air vehicles, whether A380's or balloon-borne lawn chairs, do you
not?


Jack

wrote:
When someone passes you on the highway doing 15 over the speed limit,
do you call 911 and sic the coppers on him? If you see your neighbor
in a sleazy bar about to get lucky, do you call his wife?

No, because it doesn't hurt me. If the speeding car is driving
recklessly (I don't consider speed in itself reckless), then I will try
to report.

The saying "Mind your own business" comes to mind!

ABSOLUTELY. Airspace violations ARE my business. Whether my neighbor
is a communist, is not. But if he beats his wife, or vice versa, I
will call the cops.

I don't know about you, but I don't want to be forced to file an IFR
flight plan to go soaring above 10K or more than 5 miles from the
airport.

The OLC is not mandatory. So let's only claim LEGAL flights and enjoy
the fruits of the freedoms we have here in the USA. (The naysayers so
far have been from the USA, best I can tell).

-Tom