GA airport in Paris

Hi and thanks!

700 m no problem. Went in and out of a 450 meter one the other day with
runway to spare, so that should be fine!

:-)

Is there a control tower at LFPL?
If so, they will talk to me in English, right?
If not, are French pilots required to know English, so they will understand
me when I call?

I remember once several years ago I was flying VFR past Paris to the west,
when I didn't get any more comms from Paris information.

I heard other pilots in French however, so I tried to call and ask if anyone
could hear my transmission.

Total silence....then loads of talk in French again.
I tried this several times with no reply, so I ended up squawking 7600 and
continuing to my destination.
When I called ATC they where cool about it, and told me that Paris info had
closed for the day at 1800 LT.

Funny thing that nobody seemed to care about my calls though. Made me think
the French don't know English very well....

Oh well,

Frode


"Owen" skrev i melding ...
Frode Berg wrote:

Hi!

I might be flying to Paris with my son next week.
Never landed near Paris to go to town (flown past a few times) so I'm not
really familiar with the airports there.

Which one is the typical GA one?
I need AVGAS, and it would be nice if it's easy to get to downtown Paris.

Thanks for any tips!

Le Bourget is a great field and ideally located closer to Paris than
CDG/LFPG, with RER service to boot. Unfortunately they require special
permission (!) for VFR and rarely/if ever give that permission. Even if
you
go IFR, fees /handling agent expenses/etc. are very high. A shame, but
ADP
caters to airlines and big pocketbooks, not personal GA aviators. Has a
very cool museum though.

Can you land in 700 m easily? Try Lognes-Emerainville (LFPL). It's a
beautiful and friendly little field not to far away from Paris, out toward
Disneyland. Lognes has RER service to Paris and you can walk to the
station,
less than about a 2000 m stroll. For Handling fees, you should get change
back your ?10 note.

Toussus Le Noble (LFPN) has longer runways but may a bit more expensive
and
worse, I don't think the transportation situation is as good there.

Please let us know where you end up going and what you experience. Don't
get
to hear much about flying in Europe these days.

On Tue, 08 Aug 2006 15:00:02 +0200, Thomas Borchert
wrote:

Le Bourget today is business jet and GA only,


Well, there's GA and then there's GA:

Yes, that's the distinction I had in mind! That is, you wouldn't base
your J-3 there, but for a once-in-a-decade visit to Paris, it might be
just the thing.



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email: usenet AT danford DOT net

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:17:31 +0200, "Frode Berg"
wrote:

I heard other pilots in French however, so I tried to call and ask if anyone
could hear my transmission.

Many years ago, I visited Montreal, and discovered that whenever I
addressed a local in French, he replied in English.

More recently, again in Montreal, I found that a great change had
taken place. Now, whenever I addressed a local in English, he replied
in French.

It's not that French-speakers don't know English; it's just that they
now prefer to speak French. I'll bet that more French pilots
understood your transmission than would be the case for a
French-speaking pilot at an airport in the U.S.

It's only that they'd rather have you crash than break the rule that
French is the superior language for all purposes.

(Americans are not nearly so arrogant--only ignorant. We genuinely
don't know the other guy's language.)



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email: usenet AT danford DOT net

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
In Search of Lost Time: www.readingproust.com

Frode,

If not, are French pilots required to know English, so they will understand
me when I call?


No, not at all. But so close to Paris, it shouldn't be a problem.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Cub Driver wrote:

On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:17:31 +0200, "Frode Berg"
wrote:

I heard other pilots in French however, so I tried to call and ask if anyone
could hear my transmission.

Many years ago, I visited Montreal, and discovered that whenever I
addressed a local in French, he replied in English.

More recently, again in Montreal, I found that a great change had
taken place. Now, whenever I addressed a local in English, he replied
in French.

It's not that French-speakers don't know English; it's just that they
now prefer to speak French. I'll bet that more French pilots
understood your transmission than would be the case for a
French-speaking pilot at an airport in the U.S.

It's only that they'd rather have you crash than break the rule that
French is the superior language for all purposes.

(Americans are not nearly so arrogant--only ignorant. We genuinely
don't know the other guy's language.)

Huh? So if someone prefers to speak in their language they are being 'arrogant'
or think their language is the "superior language for all purposes?' Reality
Check/ Tip: Even if someone took some classes back in school and speak second
etc. languages a bit, that doesn't mean that they necessarily feel comfortable
speaking it, particularly to a stranger who may talk fast, have a different
accent then they learned, etc. That is even much, much more the case for
conversations with a lot of jargon, e.g. pilot talk. Being arrogant would be
going to another land where another language is spoken natively and thinking that
your own foreign language is so superior that natives should speak it, even if
they can't or can't well. Don't take my word for it, learn another language and
find that out for yourself.

On 2006-08-09 12:23, Cub Driver wrote:
On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:17:31 +0200, "Frode Berg"
wrote:


I heard other pilots in French however, so I tried to call and ask if anyone
could hear my transmission.


Many years ago, I visited Montreal, and discovered that whenever I
addressed a local in French, he replied in English.

More recently, again in Montreal, I found that a great change had
taken place. Now, whenever I addressed a local in English, he replied
in French.

It's not that French-speakers don't know English; it's just that they
now prefer to speak French. I'll bet that more French pilots
understood your transmission than would be the case for a
French-speaking pilot at an airport in the U.S.

It's only that they'd rather have you crash than break the rule that
French is the superior language for all purposes.

(Americans are not nearly so arrogant--only ignorant. We genuinely
don't know the other guy's language.)



-- all the best, Dan Ford


I heard a pilot from my club describe a strange event during a trip he
and some friends made to France some years ago, when due to an accident
at their intended destination, they were vectored to a smaller military
field nearby.

The controller at the alternate field never responded to their radio
calls, until the pilot got a passenger who spoke french to make the
contact; once the controller had acknowledged them, the conversation
could continue in english.

/Rolf

In article , Owen wrote:

Cub Driver wrote:

On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:17:31 +0200, "Frode Berg"
wrote:

I heard other pilots in French however, so I tried to call and ask if
anyone
could hear my transmission.

Many years ago, I visited Montreal, and discovered that whenever I
addressed a local in French, he replied in English.

More recently, again in Montreal, I found that a great change had
taken place. Now, whenever I addressed a local in English, he replied
in French.

It's not that French-speakers don't know English; it's just that they
now prefer to speak French. I'll bet that more French pilots
understood your transmission than would be the case for a
French-speaking pilot at an airport in the U.S.

It's only that they'd rather have you crash than break the rule that
French is the superior language for all purposes.

(Americans are not nearly so arrogant--only ignorant. We genuinely
don't know the other guy's language.)

Huh? So if someone prefers to speak in their language they are being
'arrogant'
or think their language is the "superior language for all purposes?' Reality
Check/ Tip: Even if someone took some classes back in school and speak second
etc. languages a bit, that doesn't mean that they necessarily feel
comfortable
speaking it, particularly to a stranger who may talk fast, have a different
accent then they learned, etc. That is even much, much more the case for
conversations with a lot of jargon, e.g. pilot talk. Being arrogant would
be
going to another land where another language is spoken natively and thinking
that
your own foreign language is so superior that natives should speak it, even
if
they can't or can't well. Don't take my word for it, learn another language
and
find that out for yourself.

Owen, are you saying that pilots in other countries are not required to
learn English to get their license?

On 2006-08-09 15:29, john smith wrote:
In article , Owen wrote:


Cub Driver wrote:


On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:17:31 +0200, "Frode Berg"
wrote:


I heard other pilots in French however, so I tried to call and ask if
anyone
could hear my transmission.

Many years ago, I visited Montreal, and discovered that whenever I
addressed a local in French, he replied in English.

More recently, again in Montreal, I found that a great change had
taken place. Now, whenever I addressed a local in English, he replied
in French.

It's not that French-speakers don't know English; it's just that they
now prefer to speak French. I'll bet that more French pilots
understood your transmission than would be the case for a
French-speaking pilot at an airport in the U.S.

It's only that they'd rather have you crash than break the rule that
French is the superior language for all purposes.

(Americans are not nearly so arrogant--only ignorant. We genuinely
don't know the other guy's language.)

Huh? So if someone prefers to speak in their language they are being
'arrogant'
or think their language is the "superior language for all purposes?' Reality
Check/ Tip: Even if someone took some classes back in school and speak second
etc. languages a bit, that doesn't mean that they necessarily feel
comfortable
speaking it, particularly to a stranger who may talk fast, have a different
accent then they learned, etc. That is even much, much more the case for
conversations with a lot of jargon, e.g. pilot talk. Being arrogant would
be
going to another land where another language is spoken natively and thinking
that
your own foreign language is so superior that natives should speak it, even
if
they can't or can't well. Don't take my word for it, learn another language
and
find that out for yourself.


Owen, are you saying that pilots in other countries are not required to
learn English to get their license?

In Sweden, english radio proficiency for *pilots* is an option; you can
select swedish only, but you cannot then fly outside sweden without a
copilot having the english radio certificate doing the comms.

I'd think most pilots here have the english radio cert, but it's not
required.

Controllers do have the english radio certificate as a requirement, AFAIK.

/Rolf

john smith wrote:

In article , Owen wrote:

Cub Driver wrote:

On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:17:31 +0200, "Frode Berg"
wrote:

I heard other pilots in French however, so I tried to call and ask if
anyone
could hear my transmission.

Many years ago, I visited Montreal, and discovered that whenever I
addressed a local in French, he replied in English.

More recently, again in Montreal, I found that a great change had
taken place. Now, whenever I addressed a local in English, he replied
in French.

It's not that French-speakers don't know English; it's just that they
now prefer to speak French. I'll bet that more French pilots
understood your transmission than would be the case for a
French-speaking pilot at an airport in the U.S.

It's only that they'd rather have you crash than break the rule that
French is the superior language for all purposes.

(Americans are not nearly so arrogant--only ignorant. We genuinely
don't know the other guy's language.)

Huh? So if someone prefers to speak in their language they are being
'arrogant'
or think their language is the "superior language for all purposes?' Reality
Check/ Tip: Even if someone took some classes back in school and speak second
etc. languages a bit, that doesn't mean that they necessarily feel
comfortable
speaking it, particularly to a stranger who may talk fast, have a different
accent then they learned, etc. That is even much, much more the case for
conversations with a lot of jargon, e.g. pilot talk. Being arrogant would
be
going to another land where another language is spoken natively and thinking
that
your own foreign language is so superior that natives should speak it, even
if
they can't or can't well. Don't take my word for it, learn another language
and
find that out for yourself.

Owen, are you saying that pilots in other countries are not required to
learn English to get their license?

Depends what you mean by 'other countries.' Many countries predominantly do not
speak English and naturally English is not required to fly airplanes in many
countries. In the USA, FAA does require US certificated pilots know English, and
pilots from other places should be able to speak the dominant language in USA,
English. English is theoretically spoken by ATC around the world in ICAO compliant
nations.

On Wed, 9 Aug 2006 11:17:31 +0200, "Frode Berg"
wrote in :

Made me think the French don't know English very well....

Not near as well as the Dutch.