Is rudder required for coordinated turns?

Just makes life a little simpler. I once flew from Block Island to Barnes in
Westfield, Ma. without touching the wheel from climbout to final.

mike
"nrp" wrote in message
oups.com...

Tom Young wrote:
On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 23:02:58 GMT, Jose ... wrote:
The only plane I know of that had interconnect is the Ercoupe.

Our '51 TriPacer (S/N 13) had rudder-to-airleron interconnects which we
hooked up before annual insp but tied off before anyone wanted to fly
it afterwards. I never understood why there was an interconnect.

In article .com,
"nrp" wrote:

Tom Young wrote:
On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 23:02:58 GMT, Jose ... wrote:
The only plane I know of that had interconnect is the Ercoupe.

Our '51 TriPacer (S/N 13) had rudder-to-airleron interconnects which we
hooked up before annual insp but tied off before anyone wanted to fly
it afterwards. I never understood why there was an interconnect.

When the Pie Chaser was certified (about 1951), interconnect was all the
rage among manufacturers, including Beech and Piper. Personally, I have
always found interconnect to give an objectionable feel to a plane. I
hate the extra load on the controls!

Cardinals have both aileron-rudder interconnect and Frise ailerons to
counteract adverse yaw.

Bud

Jose wrote:
Planes like Arrows, Mooneys, Bonanzas, etc
automatically move the rudder when you roll the ailerons.

Dunno about the Mooney or Bo, but the Arrows I've flown do not have interconnect. You have full individual control of each of the three axis. What it =does= have is differential deflection of the alerons, which reduces adverse yaw. The only plane I know of that had interconnect is the Ercoupe.

Jose
--
There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

My Tripacer has the interconnect. I can perform easy turns with aileron
control only and stay coordinated. I can also turn with rudder pedals only,
but the bank kind of lags a little. I am able to cross control for crosswind
landings and slips since the interconnects are connected with springs. Steep
or abrupt turns require some rudder input.

mike

"Jose" wrote in message
m...
Planes like Arrows, Mooneys, Bonanzas, etc
automatically move the rudder when you roll the ailerons.

Dunno about the Mooney or Bo, but the Arrows I've flown do not have
interconnect. You have full individual control of each of the three axis.
What it =does= have is differential deflection of the alerons, which
reduces adverse yaw. The only plane I know of that had interconnect is
the Ercoupe.

Jose
--
There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote:
Dunno about the Mooney or Bo, but the Arrows I've flown do not have interconnect. You have full individual control of each of the three axis. What it =does= have is differential deflection of the alerons, which reduces adverse yaw. The only plane I know of that had interconnect is the Ercoupe.

I flew a 71 Arrow and it did have an interconnect.

Robert M. Gary writes:

It depends on the plane. High performance planes almost always have
rudder interconnect. Planes like Arrows, Mooneys, Bonanzas, etc
automatically move the rudder when you roll the ailerons.

Do you feel this in the rudder pedals? Also, do you still have
independent rudder control? That is, can you inhibit the automatic
rudder movement, or increase it?

I'll look at the sim aircraft on the ground and see if the rudder is
moving with the ailerons.

However, if the J-3 simulation acts that way, the sim developer doesn't know
what he's doing.

What is J-3?

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Yes. The rudder pedals move with aileron control inputs. And yes, they can
be moved independently of the ailerons due to the spring configuration. It
makes slipping down final in a crosswind a little more difficult since you
have the usual control forces due to aerodynamic pressure plus the pressure
applied by the springs. That's why I prefer to crab down final and
straighten out just before the wheels touch down. That's also easier on the
passengers.

A J-3 is a Piper Cub.

mike

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
Robert M. Gary writes:

It depends on the plane. High performance planes almost always have
rudder interconnect. Planes like Arrows, Mooneys, Bonanzas, etc
automatically move the rudder when you roll the ailerons.

Do you feel this in the rudder pedals? Also, do you still have
independent rudder control? That is, can you inhibit the automatic
rudder movement, or increase it?

I'll look at the sim aircraft on the ground and see if the rudder is
moving with the ailerons.

However, if the J-3 simulation acts that way, the sim developer doesn't
know
what he's doing.

What is J-3?

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

mike regish writes:

Yes. The rudder pedals move with aileron control inputs. And yes, they can
be moved independently of the ailerons due to the spring configuration.

So they move, but you can feel the movement and override it if you
want? I guess that's okay. I have an aversion to true fly-by-wire
systems, but if you know what it's doing and you can override it, it's
probably still safe.

It makes slipping down final in a crosswind a little more difficult since you
have the usual control forces due to aerodynamic pressure plus the pressure
applied by the springs. That's why I prefer to crab down final and
straighten out just before the wheels touch down. That's also easier on the
passengers.

The crabbing technique is the only one I've tried in the sim thus far.
It was impossible with just a keyboard; adding a joystick made it
possible, although it's not easy.

A J-3 is a Piper Cub.

Thanks.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

Mxsmanic wrote:
mike regish writes:

Yes. The rudder pedals move with aileron control inputs. And yes, they can
be moved independently of the ailerons due to the spring configuration.

So they move, but you can feel the movement and override it if you
want? I guess that's okay. I have an aversion to true fly-by-wire
systems, but if you know what it's doing and you can override it, it's
probably still safe.

You can feel it slightly. However it takes very little effort to
override it by pressing the rudder. Actually, in my Mooney is gives a
bit too much rudder such that I give a little bit of outside rudder
when I roll into a turn.

This works the same as your Cessna nosewheel vs rudder. On the ground
the rudder on the Cessna is a little harder to press because you are
moving the tire against the pavement but you can still get rull
deflection of the rudder.

-Robert

mike regish wrote:
Yes. The rudder pedals move with aileron control inputs. And yes, they can
be moved independently of the ailerons due to the spring configuration. It
makes slipping down final in a crosswind a little more difficult since you
have the usual control forces due to aerodynamic pressure plus the pressure
applied by the springs. That's why I prefer to crab down final and
straighten out just before the wheels touch down. That's also easier on the
passengers.

A J-3 is a Piper Cub.

That takes me way back to sideslipping DH82's when rudder was used in
bucketfulls :-)