Hope for the future

I'd rather explain this by the fact that there is *finally* something on
the market to replace the vintage WWII fleet of Pipers and Cessnas.

Well, they're not quite *that* old. Most of the US training fleet
Pipers and Cessnas were built between 1960 and 1975. Try calling them
the "vintage Viet Nam fleet"...

Does anyone still subscribe to "Flight Training"? I seem to remember
them publishing the "student starts" each month -- but I have no idea
where they got that info.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Does anyone still subscribe to "Flight Training"? I seem to remember
them publishing the "student starts" each month -- but I have no idea
where they got that info.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

I couldn't find the stats you were asking about but I did find this very
interesting
list of aviation statistics:
http://aircraft.in/statistics_of_fly...General%20Info

David - KGYH

Does anyone still subscribe to "Flight Training"? I seem to remember
them publishing the "student starts" each month -- but I have no idea
where they got that info.
--
Jay Honeck

AOPA has pilot stats from 1929 thru 2005 but it is not broken down by
month. It was interesting to note that there has been an average of 80,000
student pilots in the US in the past decade but it was double that amount
in the early 1980's.
The total US pilot stat has not changed much since 1967 averaging 600,000.
We have the same amount of Private pilots today as we had in 1966 (220,000).

David - KGYH

"Jay Honeck" wrote in news:1163767124.193662.166360
@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com:

I recently re-subscribed to "Plane & Pilot", and in this month's
edition they repeatedly refer to the "strong upswing in student starts"
that has fueled increased sales of (for example) the Diamond DA-40.

This is the first I've heard of this increase in pilot training, and I
hope it's the start of a trend. Anyone got a source for student stats?

It might come from AOPA. AOPA's been pushing their "Project Pilot" program
for about 6 months or so now. Certainly they are going to express the
feelings that the project is working, even if it may not be...

In article ,
says...


This is the first I've heard of this increase in pilot training, and I
hope it's the start of a trend. Anyone got a source for student stats?



I don't know about the stats.
I would share your hope for a trend, but I cannot be optimistic. Why?
Many people start flying, and stick to it through the costs and hardships
because of the rewards it is supposed to offer at the end. These rewards have
been substantially eroded over the years though, particularly in recent
(post-911) years.

1) The airline pilot's career will likely never have the shine it once had.
Salaries are down (WAY down, in some cases) job security as well, and the
"glamor" of intercontinental flying is tarnished.

2)Utility for the individual or small business flyer is diminished. In the
50's and early '60's it was easy to find personal aircraft with TAS
comparable to what were then considered to be airliners (DC-3's). This
combined with the proximity of local airports led to a prodigious utility
gain for those who could afford it. Today, unless you are talking bizzjets
and multi-million investments, it is difficult to find many missions where
the private aircraft offers a measurable advantage. (Yes these exist, but
they are now the exception rather than the rule).

3) Saftey concerns have increased. This is a good thing, because safety
conciousness is the driving force behind the improvement we have seen in
accident statistics. At the same time, this increases the hassle and
preparation time, and further decreases perceived utility.

4) Environmental conciousness - another good thing, that probably does not
help the overall image of private aviation.

5) Rules and regulations - not that these have increased that much over the
years in GA, but the amount of rule conciousness and responsibility we have
to digest in our daily lives has. Just driving your car to work today is an
exercise in liability protection - adding to this a "leisure" activity that
brings a whole new level of rules and regulations may not be a picture of
release and serenity to young people, already stressed half to death about
the responsibility they take on every time they climb out of bed in the
morning.

I do agree with those who say the new crop of aircraft, and the modernization
of the instrument panel represent big gains in attractiveness for potential
starters today, but I would be cautious about beliving in much of an upswing
in PPL starts.

GF

1) The airline pilot's career will likely never have the shine it once had.
Salaries are down (WAY down, in some cases) job security as well, and the
"glamor" of intercontinental flying is tarnished.

Yeah, I wonder what's going to happen when you project this trend out
20 years. With so few military pilots in the pipeline, and now fewer
privately trained pilots interested in pursuing flying as a career, the
stars seem aligned to create a huge pilot shortage in the year 2027 or
so... This should drive salaries back up, of course.

The glamor of international travel is all but gone. Mary and I have
talked extensively about flying to Europe, but each time we consider
the agony of flying across the Atlantic with the kids in a cattle car
we decide to fly our own plane somewhere. Between the discomfort of
commercial flying, and the famously less-than-welcoming attitude of
many Europeans, it's just easier to spend our tourist dollar in the
Western hemisphere. God knows there are plenty of places we haven't
yet seen on our side of the pond that are reachable in Atlas.

2)Utility for the individual or small business flyer is diminished. In the
50's and early '60's it was easy to find personal aircraft with TAS
comparable to what were then considered to be airliners (DC-3's). This
combined with the proximity of local airports led to a prodigious utility
gain for those who could afford it.

So true. I know that people in the 1950s were aware of what the
then-new interstate highway system was going to do to rail travel --
but I don't think anyone much considered what they would to to
aviation. Back when it took 8 hours to drive to Chicago from here,
flying your company's Twin Beech made a lot of sense. Now, it's a 4.5
hour drive, which most businessmen will do in a day, especially when it
saves hundreds of dollars to do so.

And, of course, everyone knows what happened to commuter air service.
With the advent of freeways, (and, more importantly, the loss of
airmail contracts) commuter air lines went the way of the dinosaur.
Let's hope the VLJs can bring it back!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

On 19 Nov 2006 06:02:18 -0800, "Jay Honeck" wrote
in .com:

The glamor of international travel is all but gone. Mary and I have
talked extensively about flying to Europe, but each time we consider
the agony of flying across the Atlantic with the kids in a cattle car
we decide to fly our own plane somewhere. Between the discomfort of
commercial flying, and the famously less-than-welcoming attitude of
many Europeans, it's just easier to spend our tourist dollar in the
Western hemisphere. God knows there are plenty of places we haven't
yet seen on our side of the pond that are reachable in Atlas.

While I share much of your criticism of airline travel, I have found
the lasting benefits of international travel significantly exceed the
relatively short periods of discomfort.

Jay,

The glamor of international travel is all but gone.

Oh, please! What glamor? Flying economy class hasn't changed a bit in
the last 30 years except for one thing: It has become enormously
cheaper.

Mary and I have
talked extensively about flying to Europe, but each time we consider
the agony of flying across the Atlantic with the kids in a cattle car
we decide to fly our own plane somewhere.

Just like back in the 50s: If you want glamor, you'll have to pay for
it. In First Class, international travel is plenty glamorous. And the
price of the ticket is comparable to any airline ticket in the 50s.

Between the discomfort of
commercial flying, and the famously less-than-welcoming attitude of
many Europeans,

And where exactly did you get that idea? What media in the US, for
example, would even report on the European attitude, no matter if it is
positive or negative? Fox "News"?

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

In article ,
says...


Jay,

The glamor of international travel is all but gone.

Oh, please! What glamor? Flying economy class hasn't changed a bit in
the last 30 years except for one thing: It has become enormously
cheaper.

I was referring to "glamor" mostly as regards pilots. I'll bet in 1975,
most Americans and Europeans would list "Airline Pilot" within the top ten
of their list of "glamor professions". I'll bet fewer than one in ten
would today - just a guess though.

Concerning passengers - when I was in High School, in the '70's, I was
one of the few (10%) who had actually flown on a plane! Today I doubt you
will find many 15 year-old Americans or Europeans who have not. There is
certainly something less "exclusive" about it.

Between the discomfort of
commercial flying, and the famously less-than-welcoming attitude of
many Europeans,

And where exactly did you get that idea?

The truth is a good starting point!
With so many people choosing France as a desired destination, it is a
shame that CDG airport is completely out-classed by the modern, welcoming
airports in China, Indonesia, Singapore and Dubai. Arriving in France is a
very "nerves of steel" experience.

GF



--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Between the discomfort of
commercial flying, and the famously less-than-welcoming attitude of
many Europeans,

And where exactly did you get that idea? What media in the US, for
example, would even report on the European attitude, no matter if it is
positive or negative? Fox "News"?

Oh, how about the time, while visiting the brother (German) of a friend in
Berlin, it was time to eat, so we stopped in at a (common to them) restaurant.
The brother and friend were a few minutes behind, so we went in, got a table,
and were given menus to look at. The friend and the brother arrived, sat down,
then I noticed her (the friend's) face getting red, then real red, then the
waiter came by. She asked (in German) "what were these? Where are the real
menus?" Then the waiter's face started getting red. He mumbled something in
German, then shuffled off. Our friend said, "We are leaving. Let's go. Now!"

We got outside, and asked what was wrong; why had we left. She was almost in
tears, and said that she was so mad and embarrassed, because this waiter had
seen a chance to stiff a bunch of Americans, and had given us the menus (that
they obviously had prepared for situations where tourists come in) that had all
of the prices about double from the normal prices.

Sounds unwelcoming to me.

I could go on with other examples, but I won't.
--
Jim in NC