Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?

You either terminate with a missed approach or a landing. The missed
approach doesn't include a 'circle to land'.

A clearance for a missed doesn't include a clearance for a circle, but
one can certainly go missed after circling.

Jose
--
"There are 3 secrets to the perfect landing. Unfortunately, nobody knows
what they are." - (mike).
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

In article ,
Jose wrote:

You either terminate with a missed approach or a landing. The missed
approach doesn't include a 'circle to land'.

A clearance for a missed doesn't include a clearance for a circle, but
one can certainly go missed after circling.

Jose

Just to be clear about this...

Let's say the airport is using 34, and you're cleared by approach control
for the ILS-16 circle to 34 in VFR conditions as a practice approach. It
would be a very poor idea indeed for you to execute the circling maneuver,
do a low approach, then decide to execute the published missed on your own.
This would have you swimming upstream against the traffic on final for 34.

If that's what you really want to do, make sure you verify your intentions
with the tower. If there's no conflicting traffic, they should be able to
let you do it, but that would be unusual. When I'm with a student,
negotiating these sorts of things with ATC is part of my job.

In article ,
A Lieberma wrote:

Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen

With winds 290 @ 8, landing 16 vs. landing 34 means taking a 5 kt tailwind
instead of a 5 kt headwind. It's a 5400 foot runway; you didn't say what
you were flying, but I'm guessing 5400 feet is about 3 times what you
really need. On a real approach in IMC (especially at night), I'd take the
5 kt tailwind over circling to land any day.

But, if it's day VFR and you want to practice the CTL maneuver, you need to
negotiate with the tower. If you're the only one around, they'll let you
do anything you want. You can come down to the circling MDA of 940 MSL
(598 AGL) on the ILS. Once you've got the runway in sight, you can
maneuver to enter a left or right downwind at your option. If you have the
runway in sight higher than the MDA, you can (and probably should) do your
circling at that higher altitude.

In reality, if there's any traffic at all, the tower will give you circling
instructions.

-----Original Message-----
From: A Lieberma ]
Posted At: Friday, December 22, 2006 4:46 PM
Posted To: rec.aviation.ifr
Conversation: Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?
Subject: Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?

Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under
visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the
clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to
the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what
altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen

Al,
Since your question seems to be more about the mechanics of the
process than the clearance terminology, my approach has always been to
circle such that I can keep a visual on the landing zone. That typically
means a left circle regardless of what the published traffic pattern
might be.

Since circle to land is published for a fixed altitude, I am
assured of obstacle clearance no matter which direction I turn. I just
prefer to keep the old Mk1 eyeball on the target throughout the
approach.

Circle to land at minimums is a very exciting end to a journey
and usually reminds me exactly how small my bladder happens to be. I
need all the advantage I can get so the left turns help out.

"Jim Carter" wrote in news:001701c7262a$f464b0f0
$4b01a8c0@omnibook6100:

Al,
Since your question seems to be more about the mechanics of the
process than the clearance terminology, my approach has always been to
circle such that I can keep a visual on the landing zone. That
typically
means a left circle regardless of what the published traffic pattern
might be.

Since circle to land is published for a fixed altitude, I am
assured of obstacle clearance no matter which direction I turn. I just
prefer to keep the old Mk1 eyeball on the target throughout the
approach.

Circle to land at minimums is a very exciting end to a journey
and usually reminds me exactly how small my bladder happens to be. I
need all the advantage I can get so the left turns help out.

Thanks Jim!

Yes, when it's a long trip, anything to shorten the approach phase is
always appreciated when "nature calls" *big smile*.

I am used to circle to approach landings at my own airport, just never
had one for opposite ends of the runway

Allen

On 12/22/06 21:11, A Lieberma wrote:
"Jim Carter" wrote in news:001701c7262a$f464b0f0
$4b01a8c0@omnibook6100:

Al,
Since your question seems to be more about the mechanics of the
process than the clearance terminology, my approach has always been to
circle such that I can keep a visual on the landing zone. That
typically
means a left circle regardless of what the published traffic pattern
might be.

Since circle to land is published for a fixed altitude, I am
assured of obstacle clearance no matter which direction I turn. I just
prefer to keep the old Mk1 eyeball on the target throughout the
approach.

Circle to land at minimums is a very exciting end to a journey
and usually reminds me exactly how small my bladder happens to be. I
need all the advantage I can get so the left turns help out.

Thanks Jim!

Yes, when it's a long trip, anything to shorten the approach phase is
always appreciated when "nature calls" *big smile*.

I am used to circle to approach landings at my own airport, just never
had one for opposite ends of the runway

The circle to land is required anytime the landing runway is more than
a set number of degrees from the approach course (I can't remember the
exact number of degrees - maybe 10 or 30?). Obviously, the runway opposite
to the approach course would qualify ;-)


Allen



--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

Mark Hansen wrote:


The circle to land is required anytime the landing runway is more than
a set number of degrees from the approach course (I can't remember the
exact number of degrees - maybe 10 or 30?). Obviously, the runway opposite
to the approach course would qualify ;-)

30 degrees for ground based, 15 for RNAV.

Also, descent gradient limitations, straight-has to be to TDZ; circling
just to MDA.

And, a third, less often an issue, are limitations on the electronic
guidance's proximity to the runway centerline, extended.

Jim Carter wrote:


Since circle to land is published for a fixed altitude, I am
assured of obstacle clearance no matter which direction I turn. I just
prefer to keep the old Mk1 eyeball on the target throughout the
approach.

Just don't miss the occasional note that prohibits circling on one side
of some airports.

On 12/22/06 16:40, Jim Carter wrote:

-----Original Message-----
From: A Lieberma ]
Posted At: Friday, December 22, 2006 4:46 PM
Posted To: rec.aviation.ifr
Conversation: Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?
Subject: Cleared for the ILS 16 or circle to land 34 question?

Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under
visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the
clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to
the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what
altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen

Al,
Since your question seems to be more about the mechanics of the
process than the clearance terminology, my approach has always been to
circle such that I can keep a visual on the landing zone. That typically
means a left circle regardless of what the published traffic pattern
might be.

Since circle to land is published for a fixed altitude, I am

Minimum altitude, not fixed, right?

assured of obstacle clearance no matter which direction I turn. I just

Actually, the IAP may prohibit circling to one side or the other.

prefer to keep the old Mk1 eyeball on the target throughout the
approach.

Circle to land at minimums is a very exciting end to a journey
and usually reminds me exactly how small my bladder happens to be. I
need all the advantage I can get so the left turns help out.





--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA

I'm not sure why JAN approach was giving you landing instructions.
Shouldn't that be left for the HKS tower, after approach control had
sequenced you in for the approach?




"A Lieberma" wrote in message
. 18...
Was out doing approaches this morning to knock off the rust.

Called into JAN approach and requested ILS approaches into HKS under
visual
rules.

Was 5 miles outside Brenz final approach fix and received the clearance;
Cleared for the ILS 16 approach or circle to land 34 Hawkins.

Exactly what is expected for a circle to land? Should I jog over to the
right of the runway on my descent and enter downwind? At what altitude?
The airport terminal is immediately to the right as well as the tower.

Winds were 290 at 8 knots under VMC.

Allen