Fwd: Ralph Parr

In any event, being a list of some 60 past and present fighter pilots
swapping stories w/each other via email is pretty cool and I've been
enjoying the hell out of their stories myself. And I will continue to
do so...but I damn sure won't share them with "RAM" (misnomer?)
since it seems to have caused such a problem for some.

The stories are great. Just add the original credit who wrote it, or if
the author doesn't want his name published then "From fighter pilots'
e-mail list" and the all is well.

I definitely want to read more of the stories but as always, even in
internet writings, author must be always mentioned. Otherwise people
will first think the poster did it.

jok

Subject: Fwd: Ralph Parr
From: "Gord Beaman" )
Date: 9/7/03 11:23 AM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

"Jukka O. Kauppinen"
wrote:



I definitely want to read more of the stories but as always, even in
internet writings, author must be always mentioned. Otherwise people
will first think the poster did it.

jok

Of course...a calm sensible remark...so unlike the shrill
paranoid hysteria shown on this thread of late...
--

-Gord.


The stories were obviously not written by the same man. Style makes that clear.
And they were not written by Marron since his style in his posts is nothing
like that of the stories. I never for one moment thought that Marron wrote them
That is obvious since Marron himself said he was never in combat so first
person stories leave no doubt whatever..



Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

"Gord Beaman" wrote:
"Jukka O. Kauppinen" wrote:

I definitely want to read more of the stories but as always, even in
internet writings, author must be always mentioned. Otherwise people
will first think the poster did it.

jok

Of course...a calm sensible remark...so unlike the shrill
paranoid hysteria shown on this thread of late...

Gee Gord, aren't you the one who slammed Ed Rasimus just two
days ago after he simply posted a harmless and amusing
little anecdote about him flying a multi-engine trash hauler?

In case you forgot already:


************************************************** ******************

Gord:

More like 'lack of knowledge by fighter jocks' has reared it's
ugly head I'd say...

It's quite amazing to me that a supposedly intelligent pilot like
Ed would show his bare ass so badly in public .

Can he really not know the excellent reason for all that "Crew
Cooperation" that he so scornfully knocks has it's rightful place
in the cockpit of a machine that's carrying maybe 400 or 500
innocent humans at ~600 MPH and several miles above the earth?.

Let me tell you Ed, there's an excellent reason.

It's called SAFETY.

Catch some clues mister.
--

-Gord.

************************************************** ***********************


-Mike (like I said, no good deed goes unpunished) Marron

(ArtKramr) wrote:

The stories were obviously not written by the same man. Style makes that clear.
And they were not written by Marron since his style in his posts is nothing
like that of the stories. I never for one moment thought that Marron wrote them
That is obvious since Marron himself said he was never in combat so first
person stories leave no doubt whatever..

Exactly right.

-Mike (still chuckling over your "Patton" story) Marron

Mike Marron wrote:

"Gord Beaman" wrote:
"Jukka O. Kauppinen" wrote:

I definitely want to read more of the stories but as always, even in
internet writings, author must be always mentioned. Otherwise people
will first think the poster did it.

jok

Of course...a calm sensible remark...so unlike the shrill
paranoid hysteria shown on this thread of late...

Gee Gord, aren't you the one who slammed Ed Rasimus just two
days ago after he simply posted a harmless and amusing
little anecdote about him flying a multi-engine trash hauler?


I guess it's true what they say about beauty (etc) being in the
eye of the beholder...wot?...
--

-Gord.

"Jukka O. Kauppinen" wrote:

In any event, being a list of some 60 past and present fighter pilots
swapping stories w/each other via email is pretty cool and I've been
enjoying the hell out of their stories myself. And I will continue to
do so...but I damn sure won't share them with "RAM" (misnomer?)
since it seems to have caused such a problem for some.

The stories are great. Just add the original credit who wrote it, or if
the author doesn't want his name published then "From fighter pilots'
e-mail list" and the all is well.

That's exactly right. How hard could it be? If these things are
originally authored in the list, then put the writer's name in the
post.

Consider this: this stuff is going into an archive, Mike. You
can bet that, someday, someone is going to stumble over it, see its
value and sit there thinking, "Dammit. I wish I knew who wrote that."

I definitely want to read more of the stories...

Me too.

...but as always, even in
internet writings, author must be always mentioned. Otherwise people
will first think the poster did it.

Come on, man. This not rocket-surgery. It's just common sense
and respect for someone else's work.


Billy

http://www.two--four.net/weblog.php

"Gord Beaman" ) wrote:
Mike Marron wrote:

Gee Gord, aren't you the one who slammed Ed Rasimus just two
days ago after he simply posted a harmless and amusing
little anecdote about him flying a multi-engine trash hauler?

I guess it's true what they say about beauty (etc) being in the
eye of the beholder...wot?...

I guess what you say about CRM being "the biggest addition overall
to a/c safety that's happened in a long time" is NOT always true:


***

Canadian officials are wondering how an Air Canada Airbus A319
crew on a perfectly clear August day appeared to set up to land
at a tiny municipal airport in British Columbia, instead of their real
destination.

The Transportation Safety Board (TSB) is investigating the incident
in which the A319, with its gear down and flaps partly extended, lined
up for the 75-feet-wide by 3360-feet-long Runway 23 at Vernon
Regional Airport.

The crew, which descended as low as 780 feet over the city of Vernon,
apparently realized its mistake and went looking for Kelowna
International, about 30 miles away.

The flight from Toronto carried 87 passengers and five crew.

TSB spokesman Bill Yearwood told the National Post, "The pilots
descended low enough that, for all intents and purposes, they
appeared to be lost, and that's a concern."

Yearwood is convinced the airliner would never have completed
the landing but the incident is being investigated. Yearwood said that
because of restricted airspace adjacent to the Kelowna Airport caused
by a nearby forest fire, the Air Canada flight had to perform a VFR
approach instead of the standard IFR approach.

Yearwood said there's some question whether the crew had VFR
charts on board. Yearwood wouldn't speculate on whether they might
have mistaken Vernon (pop. 35,000) for Kelowna (pop. 100,000) but a
Vernon flight instructor said it sure looked that way to him.

Tyler Chambers and a student were turning final for the same runway
when he spotted the Airbus about two miles to the north of the
airport. When the Airbus turned to line up with the Vernon Airport,
Chambers said he aborted the landing and veered out of the big jet's
path.

Air Canada hasn't commented on the details of the incident but an
industry insider told the Post the mishap is a "huge embarrassment" to
the airline and the crew.

[By The AVweb Editorial Staff, September 7, 2003]

***


-Mike (CRM my butt, try learning simple VFR navigation first!) Marron

I loved the story, Mike - but if my asking who wrote it causes you this much of
a problem, just pretend I didn't. Taking your ball and going home isn't a very
adult reaction to my request, as is assuming we should all know you didn't
write the thing.

Gordon
PS, if you're looking for the warm fuzzy internet, where everyone agrees with
you and you're as popular as a new cheerleader, all I can say is, this ain't
it. We still love the stories. As my old chief counseled, "Grow a thicker
skin, or die."

Subject: Fwd: Ralph Parr
From: nt (Gordon)
Date: 9/8/03 6:52 AM Pacific

, if you're looking for the warm fuzzy internet, where everyone agrees with
you and you're as popular as a new cheerleader, all I can say is, this ain't
it. We st

Maybe a simple thank you for the stories might be in order. Don't you?

Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

(Gordon) wrote:

I loved the story, Mike - but if my asking who wrote it causes you this much of
a problem, just pretend I didn't.

Hey, don't get bossy with ME, pal.

Taking your ball and going home isn't a very adult reaction to my request,
as is assuming we should all know you didn't write the thing.

Looking back, trying to do a good thing was a mistake on my part
considering how low the common denominator often sinks to around
here. Case in point: look at how Gord slammed Ed Rasimus several
days ago after Ed simply posted a harmless and amusing little anecdote
about him flying a T-29:



************************************************** ******************

Gord:

More like 'lack of knowledge by fighter jocks' has reared it's
ugly head I'd say...

It's quite amazing to me that a supposedly intelligent pilot like
Ed would show his bare ass so badly in public .

Can he really not know the excellent reason for all that "Crew
Cooperation" that he so scornfully knocks has it's rightful place
in the cockpit of a machine that's carrying maybe 400 or 500
innocent humans at ~600 MPH and several miles above the earth?.

Let me tell you Ed, there's an excellent reason.

It's called SAFETY.

Catch some clues mister.
--

-Gord.

************************************************** ***********************

Gordon
PS, if you're looking for the warm fuzzy internet, where everyone agrees with
you and you're as popular as a new cheerleader, all I can say is, this ain't
it.

Anyone who knows me would probably laugh at that statement. I'm damn
sure not the type whose out to win any juvenile popularity contests.

We still love the stories. As my old chief counseled, "Grow a thicker
skin, or die."

Glad ya' enjoyed them Gordon. But since you don't seem to get it,
allow me to explain a couple things that really are just plain ol'
common sense and common courtesy:

First, I was just the messenger and didn't write the stories therefore
it doesn't matter to me whether or not everyone agrees with me. I'm
fully capable of taking care of myself. The problem is that the
authors aren't here to defend themselves against nitpickers like you
who would inevitably tear apart both the stories and the authors
(whom, like I said, aren't here to defend themselves). QED.

Second, asking me to continue on sending the stories after you insult
me with your repeated condescending retorts such as the ones above
is asking a bit much, doncha' think? I kinda' view this NG as a
virtual hangar party where buds can sit around, beer in hand, and
swap friendly stories and info back and forth. Now, I don't know what
hangar parties your "old chief" has attended, but the one's I've
been to the participants don't usually sit around on the lawn chairs,
drink your beer, eat your food....and then insult you and call you
names!


-Mike (no good deed...) Marron