got a call from BDR FSS

Jay Honeck wrote:

I suspect they'll get this worked out soon enough. Every person I
talk to now at FSS is helpful, friendly, and knowledgable (if not,
perhaps, about the local Iowa area), and apparently interested in
doing a good job -- which was not always the case before Lock-Mart.

Their good intentions aren't going to add up to a hill of beans until
the first person takes their so-called "friendly advice" and ends up
in a freaking smoking hole. The entire casual nature of an essential
to air service is galling. This MUST be resolved. It's too bad that
the FAA has abdicated their responsibility for aviation safety to follow
the political line dictated by the contributions of the airline industry.

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 10:25:25 -0400, "Peter R."
wrote in :

On 8/16/2007 9:26:03 AM, Kevin Clarke wrote:

Did you guys realize they can't give you a briefing for a
local flight? You have to go somewhere. BHB-BHB doesn't count as a
flight. At least that was what I was told. But I digress.
Total BS, but you knew that.

Perhaps not total. The system may be programmed (currently) to
require a destination different from the departure point. Hopefully
that will be corrected.

It shouldn't have been. It has always been legitimate and the old
FAA-run computers never had a freaking problem with it.

It's just the freaking Lockmart outsourced to the third world, no
motivation or incentive, to do things safe or right that screws it up.

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 06:57:41 -0700, Jay Honeck
wrote in m:


Once they've got the right staffing levels,
and their computer systems working together properly, I think we're
gonna like what we see


With the exception of briefers with local metrological knowledge as we
had before the FSS privatization, what do you think we're going to
like about the new FSS?

Being from Australia, where Flight Service was abolished about 20 years
ago, the fact the we still have Flight Service is good. I have noticed
that they are getting better. I can get a briefing at the flying club
now quicker that I can get the information up on DUAT.The phone at the
club is right in front of the computer. I'd rather have a bit of
change, than no Flight Serice. I did experience some not so helpful
briefers with the old flight service. There was one guy who should have
been a race caller, he talked so fast.


James.

"Kevin Clarke" wrote in message


Did you guys realize they can't give you a briefing for a
local flight? You have to go somewhere. BHB-BHB doesn't count as a
flight. At least that was what I was told. But I digress.

That shouldn't be. A pilot needs to know weather trends and TFRs for
local flights as well as cross country.

I know. I ended up giving him a fudge routing of BHB-PWM-BHB, then it
worked. I didn't have my AF/D with me at the time to give him the ICAO
for Old Town or Belfast which were the first ones I chose. The briefer
was unfamiliar with the area. I think I was speaking with Leesburg,
Va. Sigh.

If you were speaking with a Leesburg FSS rep, he should have known better.
They've upgraded to the OASIS system and since then need a
Fix/Radial/Distance in the route field for local flights or pattern work.

From another forum (dcpilots.net):
"Just file the departure and destination as the same ident, but use a Fix
Radial Distance in the route field, just as she explained. Example:
Departu JYO, Route: JYO360001, Destination: JYO. It really is that easy
(JYO is the Fix, using the 360 Radial, at 001 NM Distance). With regards to
briefers telling people that they couldn't do that, they are wrong, but
believe that they are right."



Trust me. This does work even if the briefer doesn't think it will.
Eventually they'll all see it in action.


--
John T
http://sage1solutions.com/blogs/TknoFlyer
http://sage1solutions.com/products
NEW! FlyteBalance v2.0 (W&B); FlyteLog v2.0 (Logbook)
____________________

On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 21:17:30 -0400, Ron Natalie
wrote in :

The entire casual nature of an essential to air service is galling.
This MUST be resolved.

You're talking like FSS and the NAS are inherently governmental. One
of the first things the Bush administration did was to reverse Clinton
on that issue to pave the way for ATC privatization.

It's too bad that the FAA has abdicated their responsibility for aviation
safety to follow the political line dictated by the contributions of the
airline industry.

The executive cabinet, including the secretary of transportation, work
for Bush. If they don't support the regime's line, they end up like
the DOJ attorneys whom Gonzales terminated. Ex marketeer, Karl Rove,
had the morals and ethics of a typical carnival barker: political
power trumped ethics, scientific facts, prudent statesmanship, and the
welfare of the nation. Disgraceful.

On Thu, 16 Aug 2007 22:07:15 -0400, James
wrote in :

I'd rather have a bit of change, than no Flight Serice.

Of course. But why should we have to make that choice?

The issue with privatizing FSS is that it opens the way for
privatizing ATC. I don't believe that would be appropriate nor
beneficial to safety nor security. Further, it is the airline
manufacturers who have ATC solutions on the shelf ready for
deployment. Can there be any doubt of the bias toward air carriers,
their customers, that would be exhibited by Boeing and LockMart should
the acquire the power to operate the NAS? Beware the camel's nose ...

Once they've got the right staffing levels,
and their computer systems working together properly, I think we're
gonna like what we see

With the exception of briefers with local metrological knowledge as we
had before the FSS privatization, what do you think we're going to
like about the new FSS?

I've already noticed that the new briefers are treating me like the
CUSTOMER, not an annoyance, as some of the gummint FSS guys would
occasionally do. It's a matter of attitude and tone which makes
calling them much more pleasant.

They also clearly have access to superior computer equipment, and are
being encouraged to use every tool at their disposal to help us,
including websites like ADDs. This was NOT the case with the old FSS
guys, whom I often found were using less-capable weather forecasting
tools than I was.

Finally, the fact that many of the new guys are real pilots sure gives
me a sense of confidence that I'm talking to someone who actually
walks the walk. I rarely had the impression with old FSS.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Ummm, I'm finding the new FSS people to be polite and eager to help...
Sorry if that bursts anyone's preconceived hostility to the new
operators of the FSS system...

denny

I see on http://www.afss.com/transition/ that BDR AFSS is scheduled to
be closed on September 24 which is delayed from August 20 which was
delayed from July 9.

Unfortunately those delays can't keep going on forever. After all, it's
a private company now, not the government.

On Aug 16, 8:26 am, Kevin Clarke wrote:
I'll try to make this long story brief.

On 7/29 I filed via DUATS an IFR departure from KFIT to KBHB via ENE.
This was at 1200Z. My proposed time off was 1500z. My morning went
quicker so when I got to the airport I called BDR FSS on the RCO 118.025
and amended my time off for 1300Z and filed for an alternate KBGR.

They had no record of my flight plan and called into Boston to get the
info, which I thought was strange. After my runup I called BDR for my
clearance and the controller said, you want to leave now? I wanted the
clearance before I went wheels up because there was SCT at 020. I didn't
want to play dodge-ums, while copying the clearance and programming the
GNS. He said he couldn't get a clearance and would I depart VFR and
pickup my clearance with BOS APPCH on 118.125 (or some such freq). he
commented that that was a good frequency to use. Which I thought was
strange terminology. Normally in this area out of Fitchburg we dial up
BOS on 124.4. But wanting to get underway I departed VFR, dialed up BOS
for the clearance. They seemed surprised I was airborne and had to
scramble to get me the clearance. I got vectored south-east (hdg 160)
which is unusual for a departure out of KFIT but eventually got my
clearance and was turned on course direct ENE.

All along the route as I got transferred from controller to controller
they kept asking "where are you going?". So something was lost and not
in the system. If you check out flightaware.com (N15892) I apparently
diverted to Portland on this flight. Which I did not, it was 5000' below
me. :-) The whole thing was very strange.

The flight was uneventful (I shot a much better ILS through actual this
time into KBHB). I called up the comment line that was posted in this
newsgroup recently and reported my experience, plus some other FSS
weirdness that I experienced the next day trying to get a standard
briefing. Did you guys realize they can't give you a briefing for a
local flight? You have to go somewhere. BHB-BHB doesn't count as a
flight. At least that was what I was told. But I digress.

Anyway, yesterday the Ops Mgr from BDR called me as a followup and went
thru all this with me. He was very helpful and wanted to get things
right, which I thought was great. He commented that asking me to depart
VFR was a big no-no and that the frequency they gave me for BOS was also
wrong. Anyway, I'm waiting to hear the resolution but wanted to share
that the system of follow thru anyway is working and some of the folks
there are trying to make this FSS debacle right.

KC

Interesting...

Working and really working are two different things.

There are two questions about the FSS "modernization" which are in
play.

The first is a tactical one, can Lockmart provide the service that
pilots need to fly safely? My guess is that eventually things improve
and get better.

The more pressing one, the one that AOPA and others seemed to
completly fall down on, is what is the role of aviation in The
Republic and what is the role of the government in aviation. I
realize that to some degree this is politics and I"ll try and stay out
of that.

But privatization of the FSS system sends a clear message that
nurturing aviation ad maintaining its viability at all levels is no
longer a function of the government of The Republic...It is that
simple.

I think we will all come to regret that as events move forward,
particularly as the next step unless there is a change in thinking in
DC is that the ATC system is next.

If you like how the space shuttle system is operated...you will love
Lock Mart running the FSS.

Robert