New winch height record

On 28 Nov., 22:15, Dan G wrote:
On Nov 28, 6:22 pm, "Sönke Gutzlaff" wrote:

950m steel cable + 350hp winch + 20km/h wind + ASK21 = 750m or 78%.
More high was possible, but airspace class C begins at 750m above our
airfield so I had to release the cable.

I think the ASK21 gets the best high on winchlaunch. Our DG1000 always gets
25% less high.

Greetings,
Sönke

Sönke, what speed do you fly at on the winch, and how much back
pressure do you apply to the stick?

Dan

We broke this record with 1718 Meter and a 3030 Meter runway (winch
length)
With NO wind condition. (sometimes even tailwind)
In the spring we do some more attempts for a higher record.
Then we wait for better wind/weather conditions.
We had a Notam and a privat airspace till FL70 for the lost month. on
our next attempts we hope to disconnect the cable at FL70

A winch start to 1718 Meter or a higher has some problems to overcome.
Think about wind directions at higher altitudes sometimes 180 degrees
different from ground wind.
Think about the cloud base. in most of the attempts we had to abort
the winchstart halfway due the lower cloudbase.
What happens if the cable brakes at high altitudes?

The winchstart itself takes about 2 min 20 sec. then you still have
about one minute to winch up the rest off the cable.
driving the cable back to the start position, takes about ten minutes,
so a high production would be difficult.

We had a Notam and a privat airspace till FL70 for the lost month. on
the next attempt

"Dan G" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
On Nov 28, 6:22 pm, "Sönke Gutzlaff" wrote:
950m steel cable + 350hp winch + 20km/h wind + ASK21 = 750m or 78%.
More high was possible, but airspace class C begins at 750m above our
airfield so I had to release the cable.

I think the ASK21 gets the best high on winchlaunch. Our DG1000 always
gets
25% less high.

Greetings,
Sönke

Sönke, what speed do you fly at on the winch, and how much back
pressure do you apply to the stick?

Around 100km/h and the stick full pulled back (I know that's not the optimal
position).
Another helpfull fact is, that the wind is getting stronger when you get
higher so the plane is flying like a kite.
But there are only 1 or 2 days during the year when we have such perfect
wind. Normaly we are reaching around 500m with the 21.

Sönke

On Nov 29, 8:13 pm, "Sönke Gutzlaff" wrote:
Around 100km/h and the stick full pulled back (I know that's not the optimal
position)

Judging by your results that's optimal ;-). However at 54 knots and
full back stick you must have been fairly close to the stall. With the
K21's hook being pretty much on the CG point (unlike, say, a K13's
quite forwards hook) I'd worry about what happens on a cable break. If
you were really switched on I expect it would be fine but with a
moment's hesitation you could end up very nose-high without much
speed...


Dan

how many glider club or commercial operations have 10,000ft of "runway"
available.
granted.. for most 4000ft runways.. it could prove very beneficial

BT

"Bill Daniels" bildan@comcast-dot-net wrote in message
...
From Europe:

________________________________________________
"On Sun, November 25, 2007 9:31 am, peternarinx wrote:
Yesterday, on the airfield of Weelde ( EBWE) in Belgium, Peter
Mink reached 1718m AGL with an ASK21 and a Mel winch."

"The length of the runway is 3100m including the grass at both ends
and the winch is on the ground. You can see the airfield on google
earth 51 23 48 N , 04 37 77 E. They said that the conditions were
not optimal yesterday......."
_________________________________________________

1718 meters is 5,636 feet AGL. The runway length is 3100 meters or
10,170 feet.

With the new light weight UHMWPE winch rope and a modern high performance
winch, great heights can be achieved.

Bill Daniels

In my corner of the soaring world, we have lots of 1 mile by 1 mile
fields (section lines) so the diagonals area bit under 7500 ft. Still
might be good for an almost 4000 ft launch. Any friendly farmers out
there?

Rent a 100' wide swath in the middle of a field.

Mike Schumann

"Todd" wrote in message
...
In my corner of the soaring world, we have lots of 1 mile by 1 mile
fields (section lines) so the diagonals area bit under 7500 ft. Still
might be good for an almost 4000 ft launch. Any friendly farmers out
there?



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Mike Schumann wrote:
Rent a 100' wide swath in the middle of a field.

That might work OK when the wind is directly down the strip, but what
about cross winds, especially with a new-chum driver or a cable break?


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

OK, Rent a 200' wide strip and ask the farmer to plant soybeans or alfalfa.

Mike Schumann

"Martin Gregorie" wrote in message
...
Mike Schumann wrote:
Rent a 100' wide swath in the middle of a field.

That might work OK when the wind is directly down the strip, but what
about cross winds, especially with a new-chum driver or a cable break?


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Sun, 25 Nov 2007 15:53:27 -0800, "BT" wrote:

how many glider club or commercial operations have 10,000ft of "runway"
available.
granted.. for most 4000ft runways.. it could prove very beneficial

BT

Wouldn't it be possible to locate the winch outside the airfield's
boundary, and launch with a longer rope on a 600m runway?
Is this common practice at some glider sites?


Aldo Cernezzi

2cernauta2 wrote:

Wouldn't it be possible to locate the winch outside the airfield's
boundary, and launch with a longer rope on a 600m runway?
Is this common practice at some glider sites?

If geography allows you to retrieve the cable (no bushes, roads, walls,
rivers, whatever between start place and winch), if the safety of
uninvolved persons is not compromised, if there's no road, house,
whatever the cable can fall onto, if you can find an agreement with the
farmers whose fields you will cross while retrieveing the cable... and
be sure there's no regulation which prohibits cables above a certain
height. If you can fulfill all these requirements, then it would
certainly be worth to give it a try.