Winston Churchill As Anthrax Bomber

"John Mullen" wrote in message
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Spiv wrote:
"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

"Spiv" wrote in message
...

The Germans bombed Dublin by mistake once by a lone plane which dropped
bombs in a park or somewhere harmless.

Sorry the German did a bit of isolated bombing and killed a number of
people.

DeValera ordered all lights to
always remain on and added more. This clearly was not to protect
Dublin
at all, it was a clear effective beacon to guide planes to Liverpool.
The
people of Liverpool never forgave the Irish for what they did.

Now last time I checked Dublin was a LONG way from Liverpool
so pray tell how having its lights could aid the Luftwaffe target that
city?

It is due west of Liverpool. See Dublin to the west then steer due east
and
you hit it.

Actually coastal cities are fairly easy to find even when blacked out.
Read up on Hamburg etc. No need for your urban myth!

You obviously didn't know where Liverpool was. In a full moon they are
easy enough. At one point the whole of the Manchester Ship canal was spayed
with sawdust to prevent it shining back. German bomber coming in from the
east could follow the canal to Liverpool in a good moon.

Perhaps the Americans were
helping by not blacking out NYC in 1940 ?

You have a sense of humour I see.

How about the lights in Stockholm - were they a beacon pointing to
Newcastle do you think ?

Oh you are fun.

Well it makes almost as much sense as your Dublin story...

By your name you are Irish or of Irish decent. And yes the Irish did light
up Dublin with extra lights. Don't like that do you?


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"Spiv" wrote in message
...



Now last time I checked Dublin was a LONG way from Liverpool
so pray tell how having its lights could aid the Luftwaffe target that
city
?

It is due west of Liverpool. See Dublin to the west then steer due east
and
you hit it.


Or Holyhead, Colwyn Bay, Birkenhead etc.

Fact is Luftwaffe bases were in Norway and France, they werent
about to fly across the entire width of England, cross the Irish Sea
and then come back again. Its just silly.


Perhaps the Americans were
helping by not blacking out NYC in 1940 ?

You have a sense of humour I see.


How about the lights in Stockholm - were they a beacon pointing to
Newcastle do you think ?

Oh you are fun.


While you are merely funny.

Keith

"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

"Spiv" wrote in message
...

Now last time I checked Dublin was a LONG way from Liverpool
so pray tell how having its lights could aid the Luftwaffe target
that
city
?

It is due west of Liverpool. See Dublin to the west
then steer due east and you hit it.

Or Holyhead, Colwyn Bay, Birkenhead etc.

Birkenhead is opposite Liverpool, then they see the large cathedral tower
and then the convoy docks are beneath. Birkenhead is part of the Mersey
dock complex and was also heavily bombed.

Fact is Luftwaffe bases were in Norway and France, they werent
about to fly across the entire width of England, cross the Irish Sea
and then come back again. Its just silly.

You obviously don't know. German bases were well into France and they flew
up the Irish Sea to get Liverpool, Belfast and Glasgow. The Norwegian based
planes would go across the North Sea.



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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 23:26:56 -0000, "Spiv" wrote:




The Germans bombed Dublin by mistake once by a lone plane which dropped
bombs in a park or somewhere harmless. DeValera ordered all lights to
always remain on and added more.


You're now regurgitating the same crap as the idiots who claim that U boats
were being refuelled on the irish west coast. Of course occams razor is
little blunt around those who cannot figure out where the hundreds of
tonnes of heavy fuel oil came from to do so.

This clearly was not to protect Dublin at
all, it was a clear effective beacon to guide planes to Liverpool. The
people of Liverpool never forgave the Irish for what they did.

That bilge and you know it you clown.

I'm sure the British were terribly annoyed that Ireland remained
neutral during WWII.

Not really.

Oh do shut up you ignorant prat, I suggest you read Churchills VE speech
and the very pointed reference to it contained within.



greg

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You do a lot less thundering in the pulpit against the Harlot
after she marches right down the aisle and kicks you in the nuts.

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

I'd be interested in any cites you can produce for the claim that the
Irish (presumably the government?) put on extra lights to help German
bombers. It would have been a breach of neutrality which would surprise
me.

It would also have been an astonishing waste of money, in a very lean
time, which would surprise me even more.

I'm sure the British were terribly annoyed that Ireland remained
neutral during WWII. Still, they got hundreds of thousands of Irish
workers and soldiers, not to mention Irish greengoods and beef, and
any British or American airmen who went down over the Republic were
quietly returned across the border to northern Ireland, so it really
worked out quite well in the end.

Irish men and women joined the British Armed Forces in the Second World War
with nearly 2,000 killed. The IRA is known to have helped the Germans by
providing intelligence about Belfast a major shipbuilding city (they built
the Titanic), in the north, still in the UK. The city was almost destroyed
in four Luftwaffe bombing raids in 1941.

There were claims that people living in the Republic close to the border
with Ulster, turned on their house lights at night to guide the German
bombers into Belfast.

Seven Irishmen from the Republic won VCs. During WW2. Irish newspapers were
censored, and not allowed to refer to people from the Republic fighting for
the British. The Irish referred to WW2 as "the emergency".

The British-hating premier de Valera delivered a clear message in 1945. He
signed a book of condolence at the German embassy in Dublin, to mark the
death of Adolf Hitler.



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On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 23:08:11 +0000, Greg Hennessy
wrote:

It would also have been an astonishing waste of money, in a very lean
time, which would surprise me even more.

In a country with just 3 merchant ships to keep it supplied thats not
surprising.

They didn't have 3 ocean-going ships until Lemass got going in 1942.
Meanwhile, and afterwards, all Irisih imports crossed the German Uboat
blockade in British ships or ships in British-controlled convoys.

I'm sure the British were terribly annoyed that Ireland remained
neutral during WWII.

Handing back the treaty ports in 1938 was a gross act of stupidity.

It just proved, once again, that appeasement didn't work. For all de
Valera's encouraging noises about how dealing with such "injustices"
would improve relations, the British lost in the exchange and gained
nothing in return.

Gavin Bailey

On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 09:54:24 +0000, Presidente Alcazar
wrote:


In a country with just 3 merchant ships to keep it supplied thats not
surprising.

They didn't have 3 ocean-going ships until Lemass got going in 1942.

Even at that, they were little more than hulks.

Meanwhile, and afterwards, all Irisih imports crossed the German Uboat
blockade in British ships or ships in British-controlled convoys.

And at the very bottom of the UK priority list understandably.

I'm sure the British were terribly annoyed that Ireland remained
neutral during WWII.

Handing back the treaty ports in 1938 was a gross act of stupidity.

It just proved, once again, that appeasement didn't work. For all de
Valera's encouraging noises about how dealing with such "injustices"
would improve relations, the British lost in the exchange and gained
nothing in return.

A ludicrous decision which cost the lives of thousands both directly and
indirectly.


greg




--
You do a lot less thundering in the pulpit against the Harlot
after she marches right down the aisle and kicks you in the nuts.

Not that anyone's paying attention to the subject line anymore, but there's a
fascinating exchange about it in the Bulletin of Atomic Scientists, November
1987. pp42-45.
Barton J. Bernstein wrote an article describing "Churchill's Secret Biological
Weapons" in the January/February issue. A response appeared from R.V. Jones and
J.M. Lewis. Jones was head of Scientific Intelligence at the Air Ministry; a
pioneer in the field, if not THE pioneer. He politely but carefully
demonstrated Bernstein's near complete misunderstanding and misuse of the
available information on the subject.
Bernstein's response was the kind of bluster that undergraduates are used to
from tenured professers, and that graduate students are used to hearing from
unprepared lecturers caught out.
In short, anthrax was researched as a possible threat from the enemy and as a
retaliatory weapon in case of attack. There were no plans to use it as an
offensive or "terror" weapon--that's what Bomber Command was for.
The opinion seems to have been that it was like poison gas--difficult to
control and nearly as great a danger to one's own troops as it was to the
enemy. That stocks of gas were kept on hand near all the fronts, but never
used, shows that it was a retaliatory weapon for attacks that never came. Like
anthrax.