Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort

Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: (ArtKramr)
Date: 2/11/04 5:38 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: "Bob's Your Uncle"
Date: 2/11/04 5:16 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:


"M. J. Powell" wrote in message

...snip...
B-26's carry bombardier navigators. Each one in the formation plots the
flight as though he was flying lead. As I
was plotting our course my plot looked as though the lead was taking us
right
over Frankfort.I must have
made a mistake in my plot. I did it over and over. No mistake. When we
landed
we all talked about the error. It seems everyone knew where we were
except for
the lead navigator. We paid a high price for maintaining iron discipline
in
radio silence. One more point, We never saw that navigator again.

Art, I would like to ask some stupid questions. Why keep radio silence
then? Mike
--
M.J.Powell

Why are these psuedo navigators plottting a course for home after hitting
the taret? One would think they would have that pre-planned as well as a
course from the secondary.
This narrative is from someone who doesn't know the difference between
Compass Deviation and Magnetic Variation, as we remember!
Perhaps, in additio he meant a Heading instead of a Course?


Any one of us could have been hit at any time and have to fall out of the
formation and plot an alternate course home. So we all kept track. But anyone
who ever flew a mission would know that and not have to ask.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer



We must never forget "Lady be Good" It still lives in all our nightmares.



Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: "M. J. Powell"
Date: 2/11/04 4:07 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

In message , ArtKramr
writes
The mission was far into Germany at the very limit of our fuel reserves. I
don't remember the target but I never will forget the return flight. B-26's
carry bombardier navigators. Each one in the formation plots the flight as
though he was flying lead. After we hit the target we turned toward home.
As I
was plotting our course my plot looked as though the lead was taking us
right
over Frankfort. Impossible, Frankfort was defended by 600 guns, I must have
made a mistake in my plot. I did it over and over. No mistake. We were
headed
right for Frankfort and the 600 guns. .Yet no one broke radio silence
Suddenly
the sky filled with violent accurate flak. We lost two planes that day over
Frankfort 12 aircrew dead because of navigational carelessness. When we
landed
we all talked about the error. It seems everyone knew where we were except
for
the lead navigator. We paid a high price for maintaining iron discipline in
radio silence. One more point, We never saw that navigator again.

Art, I would like to ask some stupid questions. Why keep radio silence
then? If someone had put a quick question to the lead a/c what would
have been lost? Your radio frequencies were changed for each mission? It
would have been amazing if the enemy heard the transmissions. If he had,
what would he have gained? There wouldn't have been time to DF you. And
he knew where you were anyway.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell


Of course they knew we were there. They were shooting at us. And every one of
us thought just that. But we can't have a situation where radio silence must be
kept unless someone thinks other wise. In that case everyone would be blabbing
over the radio all the damn time. So the rule is trict and allows for no
exceptions. Radio silence. Always radio silence. No exceptions. No matter
what. It is the way we were trained. and that is how we flew our missions. For
better or for worse.


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

In message , ArtKramr
writes
Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: "M. J. Powell"
landed

snip

Art, I would like to ask some stupid questions. Why keep radio silence
then? If someone had put a quick question to the lead a/c what would
have been lost? Your radio frequencies were changed for each mission? It
would have been amazing if the enemy heard the transmissions. If he had,
what would he have gained? There wouldn't have been time to DF you. And
he knew where you were anyway.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell


Of course they knew we were there. They were shooting at us. And every one of
us thought just that. But we can't have a situation where radio silence must be
kept unless someone thinks other wise. In that case everyone would be blabbing
over the radio all the damn time. So the rule is trict and allows for no
exceptions. Radio silence. Always radio silence. No exceptions. No matter
what. It is the way we were trained. and that is how we flew our missions. For
better or for worse.

Weeelll......I hate to criticise, but surely real emergencies can take
priority? The formation captain (?) can close down any chatter, as on an
intercom.

To lose a couple of planes and crews for want of a short comment, seems
a very high price to pay for prohibiting something that serves a useful
purpose.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell

Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: "M. J. Powell"
Date: 2/11/04 7:54 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

In message , ArtKramr
writes
Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: "M. J. Powell"
landed

snip

Art, I would like to ask some stupid questions. Why keep radio silence
then? If someone had put a quick question to the lead a/c what would
have been lost? Your radio frequencies were changed for each mission? It
would have been amazing if the enemy heard the transmissions. If he had,
what would he have gained? There wouldn't have been time to DF you. And
he knew where you were anyway.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell


Of course they knew we were there. They were shooting at us. And every one
of
us thought just that. But we can't have a situation where radio silence must
be
kept unless someone thinks other wise. In that case everyone would be
blabbing
over the radio all the damn time. So the rule is trict and allows for no
exceptions. Radio silence. Always radio silence. No exceptions. No matter
what. It is the way we were trained. and that is how we flew our missions.
For
better or for worse.

Weeelll......I hate to criticise, but surely real emergencies can take
priority? The formation captain (?) can close down any chatter, as on an
intercom.

To lose a couple of planes and crews for want of a short comment, seems
a very high price to pay for prohibiting something that serves a useful
purpose.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell


I agree. But Ike thought otherwise. (sigh)


Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer

In message , ArtKramr
writes
Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: "M. J. Powell"
Date: 2/11/04 7:54 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

In message , ArtKramr
writes
Subject: Radio Silence and Death over Frankfort
From: "M. J. Powell"
landed

snip

Art, I would like to ask some stupid questions. Why keep radio silence
then? If someone had put a quick question to the lead a/c what would
have been lost? Your radio frequencies were changed for each mission? It
would have been amazing if the enemy heard the transmissions. If he had,
what would he have gained? There wouldn't have been time to DF you. And
he knew where you were anyway.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell


Of course they knew we were there. They were shooting at us. And every one
of
us thought just that. But we can't have a situation where radio silence must
be
kept unless someone thinks other wise. In that case everyone would be
blabbing
over the radio all the damn time. So the rule is trict and allows for no
exceptions. Radio silence. Always radio silence. No exceptions. No matter
what. It is the way we were trained. and that is how we flew our missions.
For
better or for worse.

Weeelll......I hate to criticise, but surely real emergencies can take
priority? The formation captain (?) can close down any chatter, as on an
intercom.

To lose a couple of planes and crews for want of a short comment, seems
a very high price to pay for prohibiting something that serves a useful
purpose.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell


I agree. But Ike thought otherwise. (sigh)

I wonder who his Chief Signals Officer was?

Mike
--
M.J.Powell