Flying from the US into Canada (Toronto)

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message ...
"Martin Hotze" wrote in message
...
don't you need a photo-id anyway as a pilot flying in the US?

"Photo ID" and "proof of citizenship" are not the same.

That said, I was not aware of any requirement to carry proof of citizenship.
Many US and Canada citizens both have never been issued a passport, and
certainly do not travel with their birth certificate, and yet they are
permitted to cross the Canada-US border freely.

If there's a requirement to carry proof of citizenship, it's new. There
never was one the last time I flew between the US and Canada (which
admittedly was quite a while ago, and well before 9/11/01).


I've done it many times between the U.S. and Mexico and now once
between Canada and the U.S. Canada wanted proof of citizenship for
everyone on board. They were pretty tight about it too. I've never had
the U.S. ask for anyone other than me (the pilot). However, 2 of my
pax are under 10 so it may be easier with them.

BTW: When I got back from Canada yesterday the customs guy at Friday
was talking about how crazy the boarder is in Canada right now. He
said its unbelievable how easy it is for crazies to get resident
permits to live in Canada. He said the U.S. is 10 times more worried
about the type of people coming in from Canada than Mexico. Mexico is
actually a bit of work to get resident Visas, he said Canada takes
anyone, regardless of their terrorist history. He also said the U.S.
has offered to train the Canadian boarder patrol but they did not
accept.

-Robert

Kobra wrote:

After the 4th of July I am planning a flight from the Philadelphia area to
Niagara Falls (YSN).

This may be a bit late, but there are a couple of web sites not already
mentioned that discuss the general requirements, which you might find
useful. Here is one from a member of the Rochester Flying Club:

http://www.rochesterflyingclub.com/f...o_canada.shtml

Be sure to check the links at the bottom of the page.

"Robert M. Gary" wrote:

BTW: When I got back from Canada yesterday the customs guy at Friday
was talking about how crazy the boarder is in Canada right now. He
said its unbelievable how easy it is for crazies to get resident
permits to live in Canada.

That's been a point of contention between the US and Canada for a number
of years. Canada has a more liberal immigration and refugee policy than
the US, and the US sees this difference as a back door that would
potentially allow people hostile to the US to get onto the North
American continent.

As proof, they cite the example of the person caught trying to smuggle
explosives into the US through Port Angeles, WA. However, also I recall
that the US tried to blame Canada for allowing the 9/11 hijackers into
the country, only to find that they pretty well all had directly entered
the US on valid visas. Trying to blame Canada suggests a certain
paranoia on the part of US authorities.

Canada suggests that the US concern is simply US xenophobia, and an
attempt to force Canada to adopt US foreign policies. (Canada has direct
relations with Cuba, for example, which seems to irk the US.) The feel
their refugee policy is appropriate and humanitarian given the problems
in the world.

Both countries have good arguments supporting their side of the issue.

He said the U.S. is 10 times more worried about the type of
people coming in from Canada than Mexico.

Now that's a knee slapper. Anyone who has spent any amount of time in
Mexico knows that it is a virtually lawless society. It is very easy to
enter that country and remain there. All you need to do is grease the
hands of a few of the right people. It would then be relatively easy
for a darker skinned person to blend in with the virtual flood of people
entering the US illegally every day.

He also said the U.S. has offered to train the Canadian boarder
patrol but they did not accept.

There is no Canadian Border Patrol. The function is handled by the
RCMP, the "Mounties." It seems condescending to suggest they need
training.

(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message

BTW: When I got back from Canada yesterday the customs guy at Friday
was talking about how crazy the boarder is in Canada right now. He
said its unbelievable how easy it is for crazies to get resident
permits to live in Canada. He said the U.S. is 10 times more worried
about the type of people coming in from Canada than Mexico. Mexico is
actually a bit of work to get resident Visas, he said Canada takes
anyone, regardless of their terrorist history. He also said the U.S.
has offered to train the Canadian boarder patrol but they did not
accept.

-Robert

We just moved from the US to Canada last week and I can tell you first
hand that the Canadian border is essentially unsecure and unprotected.
We had a 25 foot Penske truck - did the look inside? No. Also a 14
foot enclosed cargo trailer - did they look inside? No. But they sure
got excited about a John Deere tractor that we had listed as
inventory, until they determined its value was under $10,000 CDN. (if
it was more than than 10K they would collect some tax). In my
experience Canada Customs/Immigration is focused entirely on revenue
collection (taxation) first, with security being a distant second.
The US has a right to be concerned.

Richard

Rich wrote:

In my experience Canada Customs/Immigration is focused entirely
on revenue collection (taxation) first, with security being a
distant second. The US has a right to be concerned.

And just what terrorists should the Canadians be looking for coming
across the border from the US? Shouldn't the US policing authorities
have already found them before the get to the border?

In a previous article, (Rich) said:
We just moved from the US to Canada last week and I can tell you first

it was more than than 10K they would collect some tax). In my
experience Canada Customs/Immigration is focused entirely on revenue
collection (taxation) first, with security being a distant second.

You should know that Canada Customs has a "work-to-rule" campaign going on
right now because they think they should be paid more since their focus
has changed in the last couple of years from revenue collection to
security.

I cross the border twice a month, usually by car, and I can tell you that
Canadian Customs and US Customs both have their more thorough days and
less thorough days. You just hit a less thorough day.

--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
"The government turns every contingency into an excuse for enhancing power
in itself" -John Adams

In a previous article, (Robert M. Gary) said:
anyone, regardless of their terrorist history. He also said the U.S.
has offered to train the Canadian boarder patrol but they did not
accept.

Canada has offered to train US Air Force pilots to stop dropping bombs on
friendlies, but they did not accept either.


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
The WWW is exciting because Microsoft doesn't own it, and therefore,
there's a tremendous amount of innovation happening.
-- Steve Jobs

(Rich) wrote in message . com...
We just moved from the US to Canada last week and I can tell you first


If you don't mind me asking, why would you move to Canada? I hear the
taxes are really high. I was reading the other day that they want to
enact a mandatory child care tax. You pay it whether you have kids or
not, whether your wife is home with the kids or not. It pays for a
socialized child care. They were saying some house wives will have to
go out and find jobs in order to pay this new child care tax.

-Robert

(Robert M. Gary) writes:

We just moved from the US to Canada last week and I can tell you first

If you don't mind me asking, why would you move to Canada?

I also give it ongoing consideration.

I hear the
taxes are really high.

They're socialists. What do you expect? At least they come right out
and say it instead of pretending to be something else (as the US does).

I was reading the other day that they want to
enact a mandatory child care tax. You pay it whether you have kids or
not, whether your wife is home with the kids or not. It pays for a
socialized child care. They were saying some house wives will have to
go out and find jobs in order to pay this new child care tax.

Gosh, that sounds a lot like taxes in the US. A sizeable chunk of my
income goes toward educating (or at least testing) children and I don't
have any.

Strangely enough (and to get back on topic), aviation is one of the big
sticking points for me moving to Canada. I understand that it's alive
and well in Canada and was an integral part of opening the vast
wilderness, but I really hate the way some of it appears to be run.

(I have *no* experience with flying in Canada but I'm likely to get
some later this year when I take my wife to some ICAO conferences.
Perhaps I'll change my mind.)

--kyler

Kyler Laird wrote in message ...
Gosh, that sounds a lot like taxes in the US. A sizeable chunk of my
income goes toward educating (or at least testing) children and I don't
have any.

The capitalist argument here is that investing in the education of
children is a capitol investment for the nation as a whole. The result
will be doctors and scientists for the future. I.e. it benefits
everyone, not just those with kids.
However, Canada sending housewives out to work in order to pay for the
child care of other kids doesn't seem to have transient benefits in
the same way.
(Sorry, didn't mean to be too MBA here).


Strangely enough (and to get back on topic), aviation is one of the big
sticking points for me moving to Canada. I understand that it's alive
and well in Canada and was an integral part of opening the vast
wilderness, but I really hate the way some of it appears to be run.

Yes, but so in Alaska. Canada values aviation because it needs it. The
lower 48 need it but has a hard time understanding that need.

-Robert