What can I log as XC time?

Newps wrote:
The point is can you land at some distant airport and not navigate to
it. Why even put that stupid statement in there?

1. You take off, ignore headings and ground features etc, just fly for an
hour, see an airport, land (I'm sure we'd all count this an XC anyway)

2. You fly in formation, spend 100% of the time looking at the other
airplane, land - technically not a XC by navigation, pilotage.


I'm not stating my position, agreeing or disagreeing, just thinking of
possibilities.

Hilton

On Sat, 16 Oct 2004 10:39:05 -0600, Newps wrote:

The point is can you land at some distant airport and not navigate to
it. Why even put that stupid statement in there?

Sure you can! Get in the airplane, take off, fly in a generally
straight line in a direction chose at random, spot an airport ("looky
there! 4000 feet of asphalt in a straight line!"), and land. No
navigation involved!

Oh, all right, if you want to count following a compass line as
navigation...

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
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Newps wrote:

Andrew Sarangan wrote:

Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy several
requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from the
original point of departure
- the flight must include a landing at a point other than the point of
departure
- the flight must involve navigation (dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic
etc..)

Is it even possible to satisfy 1 & 2 but not 3?

I suppose that it would depend on how you define pilotage. Under certain
exceptionally clear conditions after a weather front passed through, I have been in a
position at 3,000' to see a large landmark which I know to be right beside a
particular airport which is over 50 miles away. Some people might not regard a direct
flight to that airport as pilotage, since it doesn't use intermediate waypoints.
Perhaps the person who wrote that clause is one of these people.

George Patterson
If a man gets into a fight 3,000 miles away from home, he *had* to have
been looking for it.

G.R. Patterson III wrote:


Newps wrote:

Andrew Sarangan wrote:


Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy several
requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from the
original point of departure
- the flight must include a landing at a point other than the point of
departure
- the flight must involve navigation (dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic
etc..)

Is it even possible to satisfy 1 & 2 but not 3?


I suppose that it would depend on how you define pilotage. Under certain
exceptionally clear conditions after a weather front passed through, I have been in a
position at 3,000' to see a large landmark which I know to be right beside a
particular airport which is over 50 miles away. Some people might not regard a direct
flight to that airport as pilotage, since it doesn't use intermediate waypoints.
Perhaps the person who wrote that clause is one of these people.

That is absolutely pilotage.

"Newps" wrote in message
...


Andrew Sarangan wrote:


Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy several
requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from
the
original point of departure
- the flight must include a landing at a point other than the point of
departure
- the flight must involve navigation (dead reckoning, pilotage,
electronic
etc..)

Is it even possible to satisfy 1 & 2 but not 3?

Of course it is. You simply fly in some random direction, perhaps
blindfolded, until you find a place to land.

The regulation is a little like the IFR currency rules, which require you to
not only fly approaches and holding patterns, but also intercepting and
tracking radio aids or courses. It is very difficult to fly approaches or
holding patterns without also intercepting and tracking courses, but they
put it in the regulations anyway.

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 5...

Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy several
requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from the
original point of departure

Where does it say that?

"C J Campbell" wrote in
:


"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 5...

Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy
several requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from
the original point of departure

Where does it say that?




61.1(b)(3)

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"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 5...
"C J Campbell" wrote in
:


"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 5...

Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy
several requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from
the original point of departure

Where does it say that?




61.1(b)(3)

All that says is that the cross country flights required for some (but not
all, by any means) certificates and ratings must be 50 miles. FAR 61.1
defines a cross country as a flight with a landing someplace other than the
airport of departure, no matter how short a distance it is. There are
several regulatory reasons for this. For example, student pilots may be
signed off to make repeated cross country flights under 25 miles.

There is also a special definition of cross country flight for military
pilots which does not involve landing at another airport.

Recreational pilots are specifically limited to cross country flights of
less than 50 nautical miles without an endorsement. Airline transport pilots
are required to have 500 hours of cross country time, but those cross
country flights have no distance requirements.

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote

Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy several
requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from the
original point of departure
- the flight must include a landing at a point other than the point of
departure
- the flight must involve navigation (dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic
etc..)

Therefore, your local flights away from your home airport will not count
as
xc time because it did not land at an airport other then the point of
departure.

Re-read his post. Carefully, this time.
--
Jim in NC


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"Morgans" wrote in
:


"Andrew Sarangan" wrote

Look up the definition of cross-country flight. It must satisfy
several
requirements, such as:
- the flight must include a landing at a point farther than 50NM from
the original point of departure
- the flight must include a landing at a point other than the point
of departure
- the flight must involve navigation (dead reckoning, pilotage,
electronic etc..)

Therefore, your local flights away from your home airport will not
count
as
xc time because it did not land at an airport other then the point of
departure.

Re-read his post. Carefully, this time.


Please, if you have something useful to say, please do. Don't be so
patronizing.

The question was whether he can log XC time when flying locally (ie take
off and land at the same airport). It doesn't matter whether that
airport happens to be his normal home airport or not. If you do not land
at a point farther than 50NM from where you took off, you cannot count
that as xc experience for most ratings.



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