Crash at MYF today....

writes:

Don't know where you heard that, but that's nonesense.

In other words, you disagree. It made good sense to me.

It is very common
knowledge in the motorcyling community that one should "cover" (have
their fingers over and ready to use) the front brake at all times.

But you're just as likely to have to use the throttle; are you ready
with that as well?

The instructors I had made it clear that you're supposed to know what
you are getting into _before_ you get into it. And once you know, you
don't need the brake, because you know that the way is clear.

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Mxsmanic wrote:
A Guy Called Tyketto writes:

Because you're dealing with reflexes and able to act on
impulse.

Not if you're a good pilot. If you need fast reflexes to get out of
trouble, you were already in trouble long ago.

Which was my point. Could this poor fellow have been in trouble
long before he took the flight that day? I don't know. No-one knows or
will know until the NTSB/FAA investigates and comes to a conclusion.
That was what I was alluding to about age versus reflexes. As good a
pilot is or can be, that problem still has a possibility of arising the
more the body ages.

It reminds me of something taught in driving and motorcycle classes:
there's no point in having your foot over the brake pedal or your hand
on the brake lever when you enter an intersection, because if you
don't know whether or not you'll need the brake, you're entering the
intersection unsafely in the first place.

Don't know where they got that from to teach you, but it is
absolute ********.

http://www.advanceddrivers.com/Safet...traffic-lights

See that section there about Covering the Brake.

Young people may need reflexes because they don't have the experience
to avoid dangerous situations. People with more experience don't need
the reflexes, because they can avoid danger to begin with.

Agreed.
It has been medically proven that said reflexes and impulses
tend to get slower as the body ages.

See above.

Think about that the next time
you're stuck behind a senior citizen when they are driving 30km less
than speed limit on the road.

That has nothing to do with reflexes, and most senior citizens don't
drive abnormally slowly.

Indirectly, it does. With the incident in question (the crash),
it all depends on the condition of the pilot, the possible issue that
caused the state for the incident to occur, and the reaction time the
pilot had to correct the plane to avoid the incident. The reaction time
is where the reflexes come in, both physically and mentally.

BL.
- --
Brad Littlejohn | Email:
Unix Systems Administrator, |
Web + NewsMaster, BOFH.. Smeghead! | http://www.wizard.com/~tyketto
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BDS wrote:

I read something interesting some months back about age vs. the likelihood
of being involved in an aircraft accident.

The article said that assuming comparable flight experience, someone who
started flying earlier in life was less likely to be involved in an accident
than someone who started later in life. In other words, if you compared two
40-year-old pilots with 1,000 hours of flying experience the person who
started flying at 25 and who had accumulated 1,000 hours of experience over
15 years was less likely to be involved in an accident than the person who
started flying at 35 and had accumulated 1,000 hours of flight time in 5
years.
I can't vouch for the accuracy of the statistic but it is interesting.


I resemble that remark! (sort of)

I started flying when I was 25, I am now in my early 50's with 1500+ hours.
Back then, the pre requisites for an instrument rating were minimum 250
hours. I started may instrument training as soon as I could and got it
five years after my private.
I can tell you that instrument flying is easier now because I have 20
years and 1500+ hours of experience.
As one gets older, the way one learns changes.
When you are young, you are used to drinking from a fire hose and can
hold your water longer (in more ways than one).
As you get older, you have to drink more slowly and more often to retain
the same amount.

(Just another beer analogy for the regulars.)

In article ,
B A R R Y wrote:

A Guy Called Tyketto wrote:


Because you're dealing with reflexes and able to act on
impulse. It has been medically proven that said reflexes and impulses
tend to get slower as the body ages.

How much flying have you actually done? Anyone making rapid control
movements on a 182 has other issues, wouldn't you think? Sure and
steady works better for me!

Think about that the next time
you're stuck behind a senior citizen when they are driving 30km less
than speed limit on the road.

When was the last time the senior citizen had a medical review or a
bi-annual driving review?

I'm 40, and I'm sure nobody my age has recently run off a runway... G

I used to have a sign over my desk that read:

"A Superior Pilot is One Who Uses his Superior Judgment to Avoid Having
to Use His Superior Skills."

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
et...
A Guy Called Tyketto wrote:


Because you're dealing with reflexes and able to act on
impulse. It has been medically proven that said reflexes and impulses
tend to get slower as the body ages.

How much flying have you actually done? Anyone making rapid control
movements on a 182 has other issues, wouldn't you think? Sure and steady
works better for me!

Think about that the next time
you're stuck behind a senior citizen when they are driving 30km less
than speed limit on the road.

When was the last time the senior citizen had a medical review or a
bi-annual driving review?

I'm 40, and I'm sure nobody my age has recently run off a runway... G

My dad ran off a runway at age 44. He claims it was a brake failure. I
suspect he just hadn't made the transition to flying a taildragger as well
as he thought.

But, as far as older pilots are concerned, if Steve Wittman had given up
flying hot-rod homebuilts at the age of 90, he wouldn't have died an
untimely death at 91 due to flutter that led to an inflight structural
failure (his wife died with him).

I would point out though, in his last air race - at age 85 - he placed
third... For his 90'th birthday, he went up and flew some aerobatics to
entertain his guests.

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

"Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe" The Sea Hawk at wow way d0t com wrote in message
news:QfOdnbTcksnM4DfYnZ2dnUVZ_t6qnZ2d@wideopenwest .com...
"B A R R Y" wrote in message
et...
A Guy Called Tyketto wrote:


Because you're dealing with reflexes and able to act on
impulse. It has been medically proven that said reflexes and impulses
tend to get slower as the body ages.

How much flying have you actually done? Anyone making rapid control
movements on a 182 has other issues, wouldn't you think? Sure and steady
works better for me!

Think about that the next time
you're stuck behind a senior citizen when they are driving 30km less
than speed limit on the road.

When was the last time the senior citizen had a medical review or a
bi-annual driving review?

I'm 40, and I'm sure nobody my age has recently run off a runway... G

My dad ran off a runway at age 44. He claims it was a brake failure. I
suspect he just hadn't made the transition to flying a taildragger as well
as he thought.

But, as far as older pilots are concerned, if Steve Wittman had given up
flying hot-rod homebuilts at the age of 90, he wouldn't have died an
untimely death at 91 due to flutter that led to an inflight structural
failure (his wife died with him).

I would point out though, in his last air race - at age 85 - he placed
third... For his 90'th birthday, he went up and flew some aerobatics to
entertain his guests.

If Steve had attached the fabric correctley the plane would not have come
apart. His age had nothing to do with it.


--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

John Clear wrote:
In article ,
A Guy Called Tyketto wrote:

Not that it should be a factor, but I do wonder about the age
of the pilot.. How old does the general public think is too old to fly?



We discussed pilot age on the internal newsgroups of my ISP after
Scott Crossfield's crash, and the general feeling was he was too
old to fly.

The general feeling was "They let 84-year-olds pilot planes?" No
specific age cut off was mentioned, but other then Crossfield/Hoover
types, the general feeling was 80+ was too old.

John
I know some very young and fit 80 year olds and some very old 60 year
olds. I don't think age is a good predictor of anything. My father
climb Mt Vesuvius at 87 or so, my mother 20 years younger stayed at the
bottom.

Margy

Margy Natalie wrote:

I know some very young and fit 80 year olds and some very old 60 year
olds. I don't think age is a good predictor of anything. My father
climb Mt Vesuvius at 87 or so, my mother 20 years younger stayed at the
bottom.

Margy


As someone who is getting older, I agree wholeheartedly with you
sentiment and doubt that I will be able to climb Mt. Vesuvius when I'm
87. However, I have "climbed" Mt. Vesuvius. To put it in perspective,
one arrives at the ticket booths by bus, taxi, etc. and walks up a wide
trail to the top. The trail is 860 meters long and rises 135 meters to a
max altitude of 1180 meters. It takes 15-20 minutes at a leisurely pace.
It's more of a stroll than a climb. But kudos to your father.

Recently, RomeoMike posted:

Margy Natalie wrote:

I know some very young and fit 80 year olds and some very old 60 year
olds. I don't think age is a good predictor of anything. My father
climb Mt Vesuvius at 87 or so, my mother 20 years younger stayed at
the bottom.

Margy


As someone who is getting older, I agree wholeheartedly with you
sentiment and doubt that I will be able to climb Mt. Vesuvius when I'm
87. However, I have "climbed" Mt. Vesuvius. To put it in perspective,
one arrives at the ticket booths by bus, taxi, etc. and walks up a
wide trail to the top. The trail is 860 meters long and rises 135
meters to a max altitude of 1180 meters. It takes 15-20 minutes at a
leisurely pace. It's more of a stroll than a climb. But kudos to
your father.

I also climbed Mt. Vesuvius on this trail about 15 years ago... got to the
top, saw the tram that I could have taken instead, slapped head...

Neil

RomeoMike writes:

As someone who is getting older, I agree wholeheartedly with you
sentiment and doubt that I will be able to climb Mt. Vesuvius when I'm
87. However, I have "climbed" Mt. Vesuvius. To put it in perspective,
one arrives at the ticket booths by bus, taxi, etc. and walks up a wide
trail to the top. The trail is 860 meters long and rises 135 meters to a
max altitude of 1180 meters. It takes 15-20 minutes at a leisurely pace.
It's more of a stroll than a climb. But kudos to your father.

You might be surprised by how many people could not make that climb,
even many who are decades younger than 87. I know a lot of people who
cannot walk a mile on level ground without huffing and puffing. Many
of them are fat, but many others are just in such poor condition that
they cannot tolerate the relative workout of a brief walk.

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