Bounced Landing

Kingfish wrote in
oups.com:

On Sep 30, 9:37 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Kingfish wrote in
news:1191202200.446411.200800 @k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com:

On Sep 30, 12:00 pm, "Martin X. Moleski, SJ"
wrote:

It looks totally photoshopped to me (or CGI).

I doubt that an RC plane--or any full scale!--could plant the
mains like that and get that much of a bounce out of the nose
wheel.

We've seen this one before in this forum. I think the consensus was
an R/C jet that had some CGI enhancements for the commercial. A
real jet wouldn't oscillate that fast and make those booms every
time the nose gear touched down.

Actually, it probably would.

Plus, there are no brakes on the nose gear, so where does the tire
smoke come from after the intial touchdown?

It's plausible that they'd smoke like that with that kind of impact.
Large tires like that take a moment or two to spin up and they get
scuffed just from normal touchdowns.

Some jets do have nosewheel, brakes, BTW, though. don't think the 320
does, though.

Bertie

If you look at the full clip at the :16 mark the nosewheel locks up
and smokes. Impossible, seeing as the A320 doesn't have nose wheel
brakes like you'd agreed. I'm curious to know what large jets do have
nose wheel brakes? The speed of the plane's bouncing just doesn't look
right.


The 727 had nosewheel brakes, for one. But I don't see it locking up,
just coming down quick. I really can't make my mind up about this, it's
driving me nuts!
I have some feelers out. Most of the guys I work with think it;'s a
fake, but most of them thought thre were WMDs in Iraq.

Bertie

"Kingfish" wrote

The speed of the plane's bouncing just doesn't look right.

I would love to see someone who is good with math do some calculations as to
how many G's the front passengers and the passengers in the aft most seats
would be subjected to.

My eyeball estimate says that they would be getting a plus 15 G alternating
with a negative 15 G on the first couple bounces.

Anyone want to take that estimate on with some estimated math?

Computer animated scenes are way too easy and realistic for it to be
anything else, I think.
--
Jim in NC

On Sep 30, 6:19 am, Matt Whiting wrote:
Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

I'm unsure also. I've seen some fakes and they typically are choppy and
jerky. This one looks almost like it could be real.

Matt

It looks real because it was done by a professional production company
for a national television spot.

-Robert

On Sep 30, 9:36 am, Phil wrote:
On Sep 30, 9:53 am, (Scott) wrote:





On Sun, 30 Sep 2007 05:18:49 -0700, in rec.aviation.piloting, buttman

wrote:
On Sep 29, 10:04 pm, Phil wrote:
Is this for real, or has this video been manipulated??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bkUt9CzRpg

I've seen that before. Its from a commercial. You can hear the
announcer at the end start to say something. I'm pretty sure it's been
doctored at least somewhat.

I remember seeing somewhere that it was a (large) RC model airplane. IMO
that would seem to account for the apparent physics of the bounces.

-Scott

That seems like the best explanation. I noticed it says T & W Air on
the fuselage. I can't find any trace of that as a Chinese airline on
the web. But if it's an RC plane, the video must have been doctored
to add the smoke from the tires. I don't think you would get that
much smoke from an RC size plane.- Hide quoted text -

I was at an airshow last weekend and the RC planes have very affective
smoke producers. They add an oil to the exhaust stream to get the
smoke.

On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 10:54:19 -0700, "Robert M. Gary" wrote in
. com:

I was at an airshow last weekend and the RC planes have very affective
smoke producers. They add an oil to the exhaust stream to get the
smoke.

True.

But, as a general rule, RC smoke systems inject oil into the
muffler and the smoke comes out of the exhaust system, not
from the wheels making contact with the runway.

I'm not saying that they couldn't have run smoke from the
engine down to the front wheel of the aircraft in the video,
just that it seems highly unlikely.

From 11 years of flying RC aircraft, I am willing to bet
that there is no input that could be given to a scale
model capable of making that flight and landing that
would result in the nose bouncing up and down like that
on landing. To get the nose up, you'd have to use
elevator control. If you have that much energy in the
system, the mains will leave the ground along with the
nose.

I know LOTS about pilot induced oscillations, porpoising,
bounce-and-goes, bounce-stall-cartwheels, etc.

They may have used a model to film the airplane's scripted
movements, but the nose dance was most certainly produced
by photo-manipulation or CGI.

Marty
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On Oct 1, 4:05 pm, "Martin X. Moleski, SJ"
wrote:
On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 10:54:19 -0700, "Robert M. Gary" wrote in
. com:

I was at an airshow last weekend and the RC planes have very affective
smoke producers. They add an oil to the exhaust stream to get the
smoke.

True.

But, as a general rule, RC smoke systems inject oil into the
muffler and the smoke comes out of the exhaust system, not
from the wheels making contact with the runway.

I'm not saying that they couldn't have run smoke from the
engine down to the front wheel of the aircraft in the video,
just that it seems highly unlikely.

From 11 years of flying RC aircraft, I am willing to bet
that there is no input that could be given to a scale
model capable of making that flight and landing that
would result in the nose bouncing up and down like that
on landing. To get the nose up, you'd have to use
elevator control. If you have that much energy in the
system, the mains will leave the ground along with the
nose.

I know LOTS about pilot induced oscillations, porpoising,
bounce-and-goes, bounce-stall-cartwheels, etc.

They may have used a model to film the airplane's scripted
movements, but the nose dance was most certainly produced
by photo-manipulation or CGI.

This was a well financed commercial for a major beer company for
television ads. I'm sure the production company had access to good
animations.

-Robert

This was a well financed commercial for a major beer company for
television ads......

Well.....I don't think it's a very good marketing move to get a pilot
plastered enough on your product to get him to try to see how high
he can bounce an airliner. Must be from E. LA :-)
Better to do it remotely........like this ------

http://www.dailyhaha.com/_vids/hoopti_bouncing.htm

"muff528" wrote in message
news:%QfMi.20186$Im1.19723@trnddc01...

This was a well financed commercial for a major beer company for
television ads......

Well.....I don't think it's a very good marketing move to get a pilot
plastered enough on your product to get him to try to see how high
he can bounce an airliner. Must be from E. LA :-)
Better to do it remotely........like this ------

http://www.dailyhaha.com/_vids/hoopti_bouncing.htm

Damn! It shook that car APART ! ! !

That was Detroit iron, and built a hell of a lot stronger than the front of
an airliner.

Computer animated graphics, no doubt.
--
Jim in NC

On Oct 1, 4:58 pm, "muff528" wrote:
This was a well financed commercial for a major beer company for
television ads......

Well.....I don't think it's a very good marketing move to get a pilot
plastered enough on your product to get him to try to see how high
he can bounce an airliner. Must be from E. LA :-)
Better to do it remotely........like this ------

http://www.dailyhaha.com/_vids/hoopti_bouncing.htm

I'd have been impressed if he had been in it.

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"muff528" wrote in message
news:%QfMi.20186$Im1.19723@trnddc01...

This was a well financed commercial for a major beer company for
television ads......

Well.....I don't think it's a very good marketing move to get a pilot
plastered enough on your product to get him to try to see how high
he can bounce an airliner. Must be from E. LA :-)
Better to do it remotely........like this ------

http://www.dailyhaha.com/_vids/hoopti_bouncing.htm

Damn! It shook that car APART ! ! !

That was Detroit iron, and built a hell of a lot stronger than the front
of an airliner.

Computer animated graphics, no doubt.
--
Jim in NC


If you look a little more closely it appears there's not much more than
the stripped body "shell" and a rolling chassis with hydraulics. No engine
or interior or other unnecessary parts..

Tony P