Does VFR Operation Require A High Level Of Language Proficiency?

In article .com,
Dave wrote:

The usual answer, it depends.
Flying from farm strips, staying out of busy airspace and the like not
a problem without (good)communication.
Operating from a busy field with ground, twr, approach freq. and in
controled airspace I think having good communication is rather
important, even for VFR.

I'd agree. Some years ago I flew out of a busy Class C airport. Those
were the days when there were lots of foreign students around -
some of whom had a rather limited command of English. It sure threw a
monkey wrench into the works when one of them showed up.

David Johnson

On the other hand, airline pilots the world over manage to get by with only
a limited command of English, and the do it in the most hectic airspace you
can imagine. The secret is that ATC communications use a limited
vocabulary of words and phrases (listed in the pilot-controller glossary).

In many ways, flying an airliner into JFK during the afternoon rush is an
easier communication situation than doing pattern work at East Podunk.

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in news:1192125688.565381.284690@
19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com:

On Oct 9, 11:15 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

I have flown thousands of hours of no radio ops. The place I did this
most at has had one midair over the years.

For this you are proud? Wow baby! I've flown a lot of radioless
aircraft but damn, a JRC isn't that expensive and I keep on in my bag
at all times.


WTF is a JRC?

And why would i need one.

And who said I was proud of it. BTW?

I merely stated a fact.



Bertie

Bertie the Bunyip Sn rt.1 wrote:

"Robert M. Gary" N7093v gmail.com wrote in news:1192125688.565381.284690
19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com:

On Oct 9, 11:15 am, Bertie the Bunyip S... rt.1 wrote:

I have flown thousands of hours of no radio ops. The place I did this
most at has had one midair over the years.

For this you are proud? Wow baby! I've flown a lot of radioless
aircraft but damn, a JRC isn't that expensive and I keep on in my bag
at all times.


WTF is a JRC?

http://www.pilotsplace.com/
http://www.mypilotstore.com/
http://www.acespilotshop.com/
http://jakespilotshop.com/
http://www.spinnerspilotshop.com/
http://www.lcflight.com/jrc.html
http://www.tropicaero.com/
http://www.aviationboom.com/
http://www.aviatorcrew.com/
http://www.forpilots.com/
http://www.avionicswest.com/
http://www.vansairforce.com/
....
....
....
....












And why would i need one.

And who said I was proud of it. BTW?

I merely stated a fact.



Bertie

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From: Bertie the Bunyip Sn rt.1
Newsgroups: rec.aviation.piloting
Subject: Does VFR Operation Require A High Level Of Language Proficiency?
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 04:18:55 +0000 (UTC)
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John Doe wrote in
:

Bertie the Bunyip Sn rt.1 wrote:

"Robert M. Gary" N7093v gmail.com wrote in
news:1192125688.565381.284690 19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com:

On Oct 9, 11:15 am, Bertie the Bunyip S... rt.1 wrote:

I have flown thousands of hours of no radio ops. The place I did
this most at has had one midair over the years.

For this you are proud? Wow baby! I've flown a lot of radioless
aircraft but damn, a JRC isn't that expensive and I keep on in my
bag at all times.


WTF is a JRC?

http://www.pilotsplace.com/
http://www.mypilotstore.com/
http://www.acespilotshop.com/
http://jakespilotshop.com/
http://www.spinnerspilotshop.com/
http://www.lcflight.com/jrc.html
http://www.tropicaero.com/
http://www.aviationboom.com/
http://www.aviatorcrew.com/
http://www.forpilots.com/
http://www.avionicswest.com/
http://www.vansairforce.com/
...
...
...
...





Whatg, shlurping now luser boi?


Bertie=


hey, watdya spect?

Dave wrote:

I'd agree. Some years ago I flew out of a busy Class C airport. Those
were the days when there were lots of foreign students around -
some of whom had a rather limited command of English.

You can hear that in New York. G

On Oct 11, 9:18 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
"Robert M. Gary" wrote in news:1192125688.565381.284690@
19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com:

On Oct 9, 11:15 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

I have flown thousands of hours of no radio ops. The place I did this
most at has had one midair over the years.

For this you are proud? Wow baby! I've flown a lot of radioless
aircraft but damn, a JRC isn't that expensive and I keep on in my bag
at all times.

WTF is a JRC?

Its an inexpensive hand-held radio. One I've used in the Champ, Chief,
and J-3. Its hard to understand why anyone would fly around in a non-
radio airplane w/o putting out a few bucks for a radio.


And why would i need one.

Because safe pilots believe that having a radio increases safety.

And who said I was proud of it. BTW?

I merely stated a fact.

I asked. Notice the question mark. That indicates a question in
English.

-Robert

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in
oups.com:

On Oct 11, 9:18 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
"Robert M. Gary" wrote in
news:1192125688.565381.284690@ 19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com:

On Oct 9, 11:15 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

I have flown thousands of hours of no radio ops. The place I did
this most at has had one midair over the years.

For this you are proud? Wow baby! I've flown a lot of radioless
aircraft but damn, a JRC isn't that expensive and I keep on in my
bag at all times.

WTF is a JRC?

Its an inexpensive hand-held radio. One I've used in the Champ, Chief,
and J-3. Its hard to understand why anyone would fly around in a non-
radio airplane w/o putting out a few bucks for a radio.

Because they didn't exist when I did it?




And why would i need one.

Because safe pilots believe that having a radio increases safety.

And who said I was proud of it. BTW?

I merely stated a fact.

I asked. Notice the question mark. That indicates a question in
English.


And th etone was rhetorical, Smartass.

Bertie

On Oct 12, 7:15 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
"Robert M. Gary" wrote groups.com:





On Oct 11, 9:18 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
"Robert M. Gary" wrote in
news:1192125688.565381.284690@ 19g2000hsx.googlegroups.com:

On Oct 9, 11:15 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

I have flown thousands of hours of no radio ops. The place I did
this most at has had one midair over the years.

For this you are proud? Wow baby! I've flown a lot of radioless
aircraft but damn, a JRC isn't that expensive and I keep on in my
bag at all times.

WTF is a JRC?

Its an inexpensive hand-held radio. One I've used in the Champ, Chief,
and J-3. Its hard to understand why anyone would fly around in a non-
radio airplane w/o putting out a few bucks for a radio.

Because they didn't exist when I did it?

Are you asking me? I wasn't around during the days of the Wright
brothers how would I know?
My assumption is that the OP is not asking if it was safe to fly
without radios in 1910, I believe he was asking about today.

-Robert

On Oct 9, 2:04 pm, "JGalban via AviationKB.com" u32749@uwe wrote:
Robert M. Gary wrote:

Most pilots would consider NORDO to be an emergency operation.

I know of many pilots of both antique aircraft and gliders that would
likely disagree.

I fly antique aircraft but am not so cheap as to not be able to afford
a couple hundred dollars for a portable radio. This isn't the 1920's
you know.

On Oct 9, 12:00 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Larry Dighera wrote innews




On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 18:10:09 -0000, "Robert M. Gary"
wrote in
.com:

On Oct 9, 4:41 am, Larry Dighera wrote:
Does VFR Operation Require A High Level Of Language Proficiency? It
looks like some in Europe would think it might:

IAOPA WINS LANGUAGE REPRIEVE
(http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archive...ll.html#196325)
The International Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association has
successfully lobbied the International Civil Aviation Organization
(ICAO) to delay by three years implementation of onerous language
proficiency rules it says would severely limit VFR flight in much
of Europe. Under the ICAO proposal, all pilots would require to
demonstrate a high level of proficiency in either English or the
language of the country in which they are flying. In an interview
with AVweb at AOPA Expo in Hartford, IAOPA General Secretary John
Sheehan said the rule makes sense for IFR operations but not for
recreational flyers. "For VFR people it doesn't make any sense,"
Sheehan said. "I don't think [VFR] requires a high level of
[language] proficiency."

Given the US's provision for NORDO VFR operations, that has probably
been in the regulations since their inception, one can only conclude
that VFR operation doesn't even require any communication at all.

Most pilots would consider NORDO to be an emergency operation.

ATC controller, Mr. McNicoll does it all the time, as does Mr. Ford. I
doubt they would concur.

All public use airports need communication.

At controlled fields, light signals are quite effective for
communications, and they require no language ability.

Flying into an airport (even a very small one) without talking could
certainly be considered careless or reckless.

For some folks, flight of any kind might qualify as careless and
reckless, but the fact is, that the CFRs permit aircraft without
electrical systems (and hence radios) to operate at public use
airports, and it routinely occurs.

I haven't the time right now to research the NTSB database, but it
would be enlightening to know how the percentage of NORADO flights
that result in being the cause of or contribute to incidents and
accidents.

Don't get me wrong. If I were flying an aircraft certified without an
electrical system, you can bet I'd have a handheld radio. But that's
just me. I'm a cautious sort; I'd have a backup handheld too.

If you're that reliant on ATC do you carry matches so you can set your
seats on fire for smoke signals?

That's got to be the most sophomoric logic fallacy I've ever heard.

-Robert