Adding an airplane rating to private pilot glider

Your instructor will not be amused by your first attempts at stall recovery.
He will insist that you use power, and you will wonder why.


And he'll wonder what the heck you are thinking when you push the nose
below the horizon - Level the airplane and add power.

Tony

As Andy said.. you'll have more air sense, and know what the feet are for..
But review 61.109 (a) for "Airplane" and you'll note that most of the
training and experience hours have to be logged in an airplane.
Not Aircraft, and not glider, so you're up for the minimums as specified in
61.109.

BT

"gmcd05" wrote in message
...
Does anyone know what the requirements are to add a private pilot
airplane rating if you already have a private pilot glider? I know
the training requirements would be reduced for an airplane pilot
transitioning to glider but I dont know how it works going the other
way.... Does anyone have info on this?

On Apr 6, 11:47 pm, gmcd05 wrote:
Does anyone know what the requirements are to add a private pilot
airplane rating if you already have a private pilot glider? I know
the training requirements would be reduced for an airplane pilot
transitioning to glider but I dont know how it works going the other
way.... Does anyone have info on this?

Training requirements are in no way reduced, but some of your glider
time may be applicable to the minimum time requirements. I did just
this c 1992 and had ~35 hrs SEL the day of my checkride. But the
bottom line is that you have to be able to meet the practical test
standards.

On Apr 7, 5:18*am, Evan Ludeman wrote:
On Apr 6, 11:47 pm, gmcd05 wrote:

Does anyone know what the requirements are to add a private pilot
airplane rating if you already have a private pilot glider? *

[...] But the
bottom line is that you have to be able to meet the practical test
standards.

Nobody has mentioned that you need to take a knowledge test [14CFR
61.63(b)(5) does not exempt glider pilots from this, although it
exempts power pilots from the glider "written."]

The Practical Test Standards don't give you much credit for being
rated, either; expect to do the whole flight test.

A little off-topic...
I teach my power students to do stall recoveries both with and without
power. Why? One accidental stall scenario is trying to "stretch a
glide" after an engine failure. Furthermore, recovering without
power really teaches what a stall is (exceeding the critical angle of
attack, not the horse hockey in the FAA and commercial books). Too
many CFIs think that power is part of the recovery; well, it is,
sometimes (get more airflow over the wing), but the real need for
power is to climb.

In a multi (OK, this is more than a little off-topic), you can't add
power in a stall recovery until you know that both engines are
running. That little bit of yaw might have been a spin entry, but it
might have been Vmc, and adding power makes the latter worse. So, get
the airplane flying, then add power.

On Apr 7, 3:04 pm, wrote:
On Apr 7, 5:18 am, Evan Ludeman wrote:

On Apr 6, 11:47 pm, gmcd05 wrote:

Does anyone know what the requirements are to add a private pilot
airplane rating if you already have a private pilot glider?

[...] But the
bottom line is that you have to be able to meet the practical test
standards.

Nobody has mentioned that you need to take a knowledge test [14CFR
61.63(b)(5) does not exempt glider pilots from this, although it
exempts power pilots from the glider "written."]

The Practical Test Standards don't give you much credit for being
rated, either; expect to do the whole flight test.

In fact, if you show up for your practical with less than 40 hrs SEL,
as I did, be prepared to get tested rather thoroughly. The DE was,
shall we say, initially unimpressed with my logbook. He went well
past PP-SEL practical test standards with me (unusual attitude
recoveries under the hood, partial panel was particularly memorable --
I'd certainly never done that before). I think his bottom line was
twofold: a) ensuring that I met the test standards, all of them, and
b) seeing how I responded under pressure. He just kept turning up the
heat until I was really working hard, then kept it there.

My experience was similar - about 35 hours SEL for the ticket. And my
challenges were similar to those previously reported. However, I'd be
curious how many hours is typical for ab initio? I've heard it's a rare
student that gets by with the minimum.

Evan Ludeman wrote:
On Apr 6, 11:47 pm, gmcd05 wrote:
Does anyone know what the requirements are to add a private pilot
airplane rating if you already have a private pilot glider? I know
the training requirements would be reduced for an airplane pilot
transitioning to glider but I dont know how it works going the other
way.... Does anyone have info on this?

Training requirements are in no way reduced, but some of your glider
time may be applicable to the minimum time requirements. I did just
this c 1992 and had ~35 hrs SEL the day of my checkride. But the
bottom line is that you have to be able to meet the practical test
standards.

"Steve" wrote in message
news:vfAKj.3242$N62.1743@trndny07...
My experience was similar - about 35 hours SEL for the ticket. And my
challenges were similar to those previously reported. However, I'd be
curious how many hours is typical for ab initio? I've heard it's a rare
student that gets by with the minimum.


A discussion last year in Rec.Aviation.Students revealed that the national
average is 65-70 hrs with 40 being the required minimum.

BT

gmcd05 wrote:
Does anyone know what the requirements are to add a private pilot
airplane rating if you already have a private pilot glider? I know
the training requirements would be reduced for an airplane pilot
transitioning to glider but I dont know how it works going the other
way.... Does anyone have info on this?

I'm a bit confused by the answers to the question. There is a substantial
reduction in the minimum as per part 61.109:

It states you must have 40 hours of flight time, including at least 20
hours of instruction and 10 hours solo.

Of the 20 hours of instruction, 9 hours of it must be in a single engine
airplane (assuming you are going for a single engine certificate). The
other 11, could be in a glider. All 10 hours of solo time must be in a
single engine airplane. So, technically, if you had an instructor who
was willing to play ball, you could do it with just 19 hours.

For commercial ratings (61.129):

You must have at least 250 logged hours. Of that:

1) 100 hours must be in powered aircraft (50 of which must be in airplanes)
2) 100 hours must be as PIC
a) 50 of which must be in airplanes
b) 50 of which must be crosscountry (of which 10 must be in airplanes)
3) 20 hours of training which includes:
a) at least 10 hours of instrument training (at least 5 of which must be
in single engine airplanes)
b) at least 10 hours of training with retractable gear, flaps, constant
speed prop, etc (all of which must be in airplanes)
c) one 2 hour VFR day time cross-county in single engine airplane
d) one 2 hour VFR night time cross-country in single engine airplane
e) 3 hour in single engine airplane to prep for exam
4) 10 hours of soloflight in single engine airplane including cross country

So assuming your aeronautical experience is only in gliders (and you have
plenty of it), you will need 100 hours in airplanes as per #1

Requirement 2 says you need 50 hours PIC in airplanes including at least
10 of cross country (this replicates requirement #4). So if half your
flight time is training and half is PIC, then you have requirements 2
and 4 incorporated in #1. #3 requires 20 hours of training, which can
be fit into the 50 hours I allocated based on #2.

So assuming you have adequate glider cross country experience, the
rules say the minimum for you would be 100 hours to commercial, as
opposed to power only which would be 250.

Picking up additional ratings at that point requires very little (in
theory multiengine commercial would be an additional 14 hours of
instruction and 10 hours of solo or simulated PIC)..

That said, I'm not a power pilot, or an instructor, but I think all pilots
know that FAA minimums are just that, minimums. Just because you can
get a private pilot certificate with 19 hours, and a commercial with
an additional 81 doesn't mean you should, or you will. But you asked
if the requirements are reduced, and they are. My guess is, you are best
off finding an instructor who is a glider pilot, they may be more
sympathetic to using glider experience and more understanding of
why you do the things you do when you respond as if the plane is a glider.

Good luck,
dan