Can I fly the NY VFR corridor w/o a XPNDR?

On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 15:58:19 -0500, Mike wrote:

When I visually identify a reporting point, it's nice to
know my scan included confirmation on the GPS moving map.
I guess I'm just confident in my pilotage skills. I know what the
Statue of Liberty, Entrepid, Empire State building, Washington bridge,
etc. look like, so a GPS wouldn't help me. As you said the more time
outside the better, so I wouldn't waste any time looking at the GPS,
and given the well known visual cues I think you'd be better off not
using one.
I sure don't want to have my head buried in the cockpit
checking the chart while flying down the most crowded VFR
corridor in America.
Agreed, and I add the GPS is just as much of a distraction as a chart
for this trip.

I also looked at some pictures on the
web so I'm better able to recognize landmarks.
Good idea.

I estimated
cruise time between points and noted that on my chart.
We both agree burying your head inside looking at a chart isn't a good
idea, and is why you stated you were using a GPS. Now it seems you'll
use your GPS, cross reference the chart, and look at your timing
device. All to track check points less than a mile apart. Sounds
like an encounter with a helicopter may be in your future.

I jotted down some emergency frequencies and drew some arrows
to the nearest airports at dfferent points along the route
in case of engine trouble.
Always a good idea to plan as many outs as possible. Instead of
having multiple emergency frequencies on hand, just put 121.5 in the
other radio, or other side of the flip flop. If something goes wrong
you hit one button and transmit. At 800 feet you won't have time to
look up a frequency and dial it in, even if it is on a piece of paper.

I drew some course lines with
magnetic heading. I studied the shape of the shoreline and
decided in advance where I'd make each turn and when I'd
climb or descend.
Good to have a plan, but be ready to be flexible. I've only had one
trip up the river go EXACTLY as planned.

Which of those preparations would you
*not* take (in addition to leaving your GPS at home)
simply because, in your humble opinion, navigation by
following the river is a snap?
As already stated, I would not use a GPS, chart times to check points,
make a list of emergency frequencies, use a timer, or plan a rigid
course of events during my time in the corridor. I wouldn't do
anything except look outside vigilantly, and check my altitude and
engine gauges from time to time.


Always do as much as you can in advance, particularly the
first time.
Agreed, although there is such a thing as over planning in some cases.
The flight you are going to take is a perfect example of one.

Use all your assets, keep situational
awareness, keep your options open. Redundancy is a good
thing.
I agree with all but the first one. And the type of redundancy I
would use is another pilot's eyes, not electronic gadgetry.


In all seriousness, if you want to have a fun, and safe trip, minimize
your expectations with regard to equipment use, and bring another
pilot who's only job is to call out traffic. If this is not possible,
try to make the flight early Sunday morning as that is the slowest
time I've seen there. If you go during the week, you will be
literally inundated with helicopter traffic buzzing all over the place
and it can get uncomfortable very quickly. While I have not made the
trip post 9/11, I have done this trip about 20 times. Every one is
different, and I've needed to, "change my shorts" on more than one
occasion since the helicopters have a much different definition of
adequate separation than most fixed wing pilots do. I can't emphasis
enough to keep use of navigation equipment to a minimum, and scanning
for traffic as a priority.

Good luck.
z

Let's not make this any more complicated than it is. Fly down the river on
right side, below 1000 ft, announce where you are (including your altitude and
direction of flight) at the GWB, the Boat Basin, Intrepid, Colgate Clock,
Lady, GZ, 34th St, (any number of others). Listen closely to 123.05 and watch
outside. It's really not that difficult.


www.Rosspilot.com

Andrew Gideon opined

Mike wrote:

I fly in the 30 nm veil all the time. This was
just an extreme case, so I thought I'd see if there was
anything I was missing.

What i was worried about was someone spotting me on primary
radar, not knowing the FAR's and thinking "No transponder,
30 nm veil, approaching 9-11 ground zero - call out the
F-16's" There's no way for anyone to tell from radar that
I'm a legal exception to the transponder rules.

Legal or not, that would worry me too. Look at what an F-16 did to a
perfectly innocent school in southern NJ.

Nobody's perfect.

No doubt they'll look at your plane and assume you're carrying thousands of
pounds of high explosive.

- Andrew



-ash
Cthulhu in 2005!
Why wait for nature?

Mike wrote:

Redundancy is a good
thing.

Redundancy to pilotage in the Hudson corridor is...what? What can fail? Do
you expect someone to steal Manhatten, or perhaps to change the course of
the river?

Keep your head up and enjoy the view.

- Andrew

zatatime wrote:

I guess I'm just confident in my pilotage skills.

As am I, but like a lot of other pilots, I can make
mistakes, particularly the first time I try something, so I
make an effort to keep options open.

I know what the
Statue of Liberty, Entrepid, Empire State building, Washington bridge,
etc. look like, so a GPS wouldn't help me.

I'll bet you know what airports look like too and have never
had any trouble finding one that you're unfamiliar with.
I'm not that good. In this situation, I want to be able to
give reliable position reports, not be guessing.

As you said the more time
outside the better, so I wouldn't waste any time looking at the GPS,

So you don't bother to look at the altimeter or engine
gauges either? I do, and my scan can pick up a relaiable
location off the GPS in a half second. It's worth that for
better situational awareness.

Agreed, and I add the GPS is just as much of a distraction as a chart
for this trip.

Baloney. This is one of the most complicated set of
overlapping layers of airspace there is, and with 9-11
ground zero nearby and no transponder, the consequences of a
mistake here are extremely severe. Given that this is my
first time through, in a 60+ year old aircraft, I'm going to
do the advanced setup that gives me the best situational
awareness available.

We both agree burying your head inside looking at a chart isn't a good
idea, and is why you stated you were using a GPS. Now it seems you'll
use your GPS, cross reference the chart, and look at your timing
device. All to track check points less than a mile apart. Sounds
like an encounter with a helicopter may be in your future.

This is a 3 hour flight for me. I pointed out some of the
many advantages of preparation so I'm familiar with what is
going to happen and have resources ready at hand for
emergencies. You turn my prep work into "That's all bad
because you'll have your head buried." I't s like saying
you shouldn't carry written landing or emergency checklists
since you need to fly the aircraft during landing or an
emergency. The act of preparing such items and looking at
them beforehand to familiarize yourself, and knowing they
are there for reference when needed is the point of doing
that work.

Always a good idea to plan as many outs as possible. Instead of
having multiple emergency frequencies on hand, just put 121.5 in the
other radio, or other side of the flip flop.

Other radio? Flip flop? Do you recall this is a 91.215
"not originally certificated with an engine-driven
electrical system" aircraft? This is a handheld we're
talking about.

If something goes wrong
you hit one button and transmit. At 800 feet you won't have time to
look up a frequency and dial it in, even if it is on a piece of paper.

I'm going to have to.

As already stated, I would not use a GPS,

I would.

chart times to check points,

I didn't - it's a 3 hour flight in an aircraft that holds 3
hours of fuel.

make a list of emergency frequencies,

I thought the recommendation I read from others who had
flown the corridor to know the freq of Newark was a good
one.

use a timer,

I dont even have a timer, just a watch so I can check my
fuel burn.

or plan a rigid
course of events during my time in the corridor.

I don't consider my plan "rigid" - it's "flexible" with lots
of options.

I wouldn't do
anything except look outside vigilantly, and check my altitude and
engine gauges from time to time.

That's exactly what I'll do, except my "from time to time"
check will give me more information, and I'll have more
options at the ready.

Use all your assets, keep situational
awareness, keep your options open. Redundancy is a good
thing.
I agree with all but the first one. And the type of redundancy I
would use is another pilot's eyes, not electronic gadgetry.

I've got two sets of eyes and the "gadgetry" that will let
me carry a few extra hundred feet when it's legal. That
extra alttiude can make the difference when you're flying as
low as this requires.

In all seriousness, if you want to have a fun, and safe trip, minimize
your expectations with regard to equipment use,

It's already minimized, it's just ready.

and bring another pilot who's only job is to call out traffic.

She's looking forward to it.

try to make the flight early Sunday morning as that is the slowest
time I've seen there.

Called FSS Sun morn (yesterday) on a beautiful day. At the
end of a long briefing, where the most interesting thing was
forecast 10-15 knot winds, the briefer then said "NOTAM-
expected heavy helicopter activity in the vicinity of the
Verrazano Narrows Bridge in connection with the New York
Marathon."

Maybe next week....

If you go during the week, you will be
literally inundated with helicopter traffic buzzing all over the place
and it can get uncomfortable very quickly. While I have not made the
trip post 9/11, I have done this trip about 20 times. Every one is
different, and I've needed to, "change my shorts" on more than one
occasion since the helicopters have a much different definition of
adequate separation than most fixed wing pilots do. I can't emphasis
enough to keep use of navigation equipment to a minimum, and scanning
for traffic as a priority.

Good luck.

Thanks - really. I'm sure it will be great fun.

Mike wrote:
I didn't - it's a 3 hour flight in an aircraft that holds 3
hours of fuel.

Um, 30-minute fuel reserve?

.... Alan

--
Alan Gerber
gerber AT panix DOT com

Alan Gerber wrote:
it's a 3 hour flight in an aircraft that holds 3
hours of fuel.

Um, 30-minute fuel reserve?

Um, fuel stop?

The point was that my preflight work - from GPS to notes on
the chart - was for an entire flight, not just the few
miles in the vicinity of the Lady.