Blackbird Questions, Anyone?

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...
"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:K3vvd.4793$2r.2971@fed1read02...
[...]
So here's the kicker, I recall reading that you could make a torch out of
a T-Shirt on a stick, light it, dunk it in a bucket of JP-12 and the
JP-12 would do nothing but extinguish your torch...JP-12 was anything BUT
explosive and it required immense pressures to get it to ignite

Regular gasoline is basically the same. The main difference would be
vapor pressure; there's a decent amount of gasoline vapor anywhere there's
liquid gasoline. But the liquid gasoline itself is very resistant to
ignition (ditto other fuels).

With decent ventilation, you could put out a match by throwing it into a
bucket of gasoline.

In other words, your recollection is correct, but it's not really the
mind-blowing news flash one might think it is.

Pete


Oh well,

I remember it as a "NO SH*T!??!" moment at the time. :O)

Lots of things in life are probably not as big a deal as one remembers them
at the time.

Regards,

Jay B

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message news:EOsvd.256610

Apparently the Air Force built a huge and extensive air base in Tonopah,

Slightly off-topic. My father-in-law served in the Oregon Air Guard as a
helicopter crewman. On their way south they tried to see how close they
could get to A-51. They got within distant viewing range and, any closer
than that, he said, they might as well have been Communist.

On the way back they were allowed to stop at Tonopah, however, and he
described seeing a B-25 in one of the older hangars there, looking by the
cobwebs and bird **** like it hadn't been touched in decades, but still in
mint condition.

What's at Tonopah now? No one will say for sure, but according to Bill,
that's where he thinks the fabled Aurora was tested.

Awesome! I wonder how much of that research went into the X-34a? Did he
happen to mention Pumpkinseed? If you're able to talk with him again,
that's one for him. IIRC, that was the external-combustion project (where
they injected the fuel right onto the surface of the wing at the appropriate
mixture, and ignited it there.)

This is great stuff, Jay! THANKS for including us.

-c

Jay

Ask Bill if one or more SR-71's were lost during the Shuttle explosion
after being launched in Florida.

Have been told by a mission controller this was true. Something like
the explosion took all the oxy out of the air and '71 flame out and
couldn't get restarted or something. This guy was on a console but not
a pilot.

Big John
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~`

On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 01:38:56 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
wrote:

Bill Fox, project coordinator for the Lockheed Skunkworks (and the guy who
donated all the unbelievably cool stuff in our "Blackbird Suite") is going
to be visiting us again soon.

Bill actually ran Area 51 for a few years, and was instrumental in the
development and deployment of the SR-71 (and a whole slew of other stuff
that hasn't been declassified yet.) from Kelly Johnson's Lockheed
Skunkworks.

I've made a list of questions to ask him when he gets here, but if you have
any questions about the Blackbird, the U-2, or any other Lockheed Skunkworks
stuff, post 'em here and I'll ask him for ya!

Jay B

Story I always heard was that they took off with a light load of fuel
due to either W & B or structural limits and tanked shortly after
take off for the initial phase of mission where they might be required
to tank several times.

Leaks yes.

Big John
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 22:43:23 -0700, "Jay Beckman"
wrote:

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:ektvd.189728$V41.138784@attbi_s52...
Hehehe...cool.

Thanks!

Other cool tidbits from Bill:


Security. At Lockheed's Burbank, CA facility, they were testing the
SR-71's fuel tank and the explosive nature of the special fuel the
Blackbird used. They drained a tank, leaving fumes in it, and heated it
to hundreds of degrees, to simulate in-flight conditions. It, of course,
exploded, blowing the building to bits and starting a raging fire.


Hey Jay,

Double check something else with Bill if you still have him available...

JP-12:

So, they fill the SR-71 on the ground and it would leak like a sieve until
it got up to altitude and expansion of the airframe "sealed" the leaks
(necessitating an immediate tanker join once airborne...)

So here's the kicker, I recall reading that you could make a torch out of a
T-Shirt on a stick, light it, dunk it in a bucket of JP-12 and the JP-12
would do nothing but extinguish your torch...JP-12 was anything BUT
explosive and it required immense pressures to get it to ignite (fumes, of
course, are a different kettle of fish.)

Jay B

"Peter Duniho" wrote

Regular gasoline is basically the same. The main difference would be
vapor
pressure; there's a decent amount of gasoline vapor anywhere there's
liquid
gasoline. But the liquid gasoline itself is very resistant to ignition
(ditto other fuels).

With decent ventilation, you could put out a match by throwing it into a
bucket of gasoline.


I always wanted to try that, but I could never figure out what "decent
ventilation" was, and didn't feel like trying without knowing, for sure.
--
Jim in NC

"Jay Honeck" wrote

You can read more about it he
http://www.aleinn.com/black_projects/a12_40years.html
--
Jay Honeck

Why does anyone use a black background like that page? It is totally
unreadable on my crappy monitor.
--
Jim in NC

This is great stuff, Jay! THANKS for including us.

No problem. I've learned so much from this group over the years, it seems
only right to give some back....
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Ask Bill if one or more SR-71's were lost during the Shuttle explosion
after being launched in Florida.

Sorry, Big John -- that'll have to wait for Bill's next visit. He's off to
Charles City, and then to the desert Southwest for the winter...

Haven't seen you here for a while... How're you doing?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay

Still in long recovery from heart surgery. Had/have Afib and they
burned the inside of upper chamber out with RF energy vs cutting with
a knife. May never recover ( Have fallen 5-6 times in past month-six
weeks just trying to walking around the house.

Also loss of feeling (dead nerves) in my fingers make typing a chore.

Have pretty much gone to the lurker stage.

First Cold, Cold, Cold snap of year and freeze last night. Nothing
like IA of course where I grew up and you know about.

And a very Merry Xmas to you and yours.

Older than mud-------Big John

I can remeber going to silent movies and when the first 'talkie' came
out.
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On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 14:09:24 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
wrote:

Ask Bill if one or more SR-71's were lost during the Shuttle explosion
after being launched in Florida.

Sorry, Big John -- that'll have to wait for Bill's next visit. He's off to
Charles City, and then to the desert Southwest for the winter...

Haven't seen you here for a while... How're you doing?

Wow, I'm still amazed that you got to talk to this guy. Imagine all the Art
Bell / Coast to Coast/ X-Files / Conspiracy theory / Shadow Government /
Aliens-at-Area 51 geeks out there who would peel their skin off to see this
fellow!

He's The Man in all those Sci Fi movies where the spooks run around Area 51,
or the sinister project director and his henchmen show up at some crashsite,
remove all the evidence and the witnesses too.

I wonder what it's like to go through life knowing that there's a whole
subset of America who doesn't even know about you and yet there are movies,
radio programs, websites, TV shows and books written in which you're
universally the Chief Spook.

-c