How many in this club?

"Wizard of Draws" wrote in message

I'm #2.
I took my IFR checkride twice and honestly can't say I'm embarrassed about
it. It keeps me humble in the cockpit.

My DE STARTED the exam by lecturing to me about how failure wasn't something
to be embarrassed about, how the point wasn't to pass your checkride on the
first try, and how the instructor shares the responsibility for failure,
etc.

The FBO atmosphere was something out of a sitcom. I've never seen so many
instructors so visibly nervous. If I'd have opened the classroom door I'd
have probably caught them all evesdropping.

I was terrified, too. The previous week I heard the DE chewing some kid's
ass about flap usage and a bunch of other things after a Private exam.
Turns out, the kid passed.

-c

"gatt" wrote

I failed my Private because I used a private field as a
waypoint in my cross-country plan.

WHATTT.... No way! You can use a tree as a waypoint as
long as it can be identified from the airplane in flight.
Maybe you failed because you could not identify the "grass"
field as a waypoint, not because it was a "private" field.

Bob Moore

Jon Kraus wrote:
Just curious as to how many of us are in the "Flunked a Checkride"
club.

Count me in too. I flunked my private checkride in 2002 on the first
try.

I and my instructor had no doubt that I was ready even with only about
40.5 total hours. The oral portion went splendidly, and I was having a
mostly fun and easy time with the flight portion also when I found
myself suddenly unable to make a 45-degree steep turn (in a Cessna 152)
without gaining 400 to 500 feet of altitude. I later figured that this
equates to about a 5000 F. P. M. climb. Those of you familiar with the
C152 know that a 5000 F. P. M. climb is not typically in the repertoir,
particularly with 45 degrees of bank. Did I mention that I took the
checkride in late June in Phoenix? I now know that I was in a big-time
thermal and mother nature was adding a bunch of external energy to my
carefully planned system. The amount of power reduction and nose-down
pitch that would have been required to stay within the P. T. S. would
have been very counter-intuituve in a steep turn and unlike anything I
had seen in a steep turn up to that point. The D. E. didn't really say
anything, we just went about completing the rest of the maneuvers. I
actually meant to come back to the steep turn later and make another
attempt, and I suspect the D. E. would have allowed me to do that, but
by the time we were ready to head back toward the airport and make some
landings my mind was on about a million other things and I forgot.

The D. E. didn't give me any indication as to my passing or failing as
we tied down the airplane but by then I had remembered that I never
sucessfully completed that steep turn. In fact, the D. E. called me a
prodigy during the de-briefing with my C. F. I. The exam was on a
Wednesday, and early on we had discussed the fact that the examiner
would be available on Friday if we had needed a continuance or a
re-test. In the de-brief, I made the mistake of asking the leading
question "So, do you want to see me on Friday?" instead of "So, did I
pass?" and I got the answer I was dreading. I logged about .6 hours
with my instructor on Thursday trying a few steep turns and about .6
with the examiner on Friday doing a single normal take-off, a steep
turn to the left, a steep turn to the right, and a normal landing, this
time at about 7:30 a.m. instead of 1 p.m. Pass.

In hindsight, I know the examiner knew I was safe enough to be worthy
of a licence to learn after the first test. I think she was looking
for a demonstration of confidence as well as a demonstration of
competence and that if I had phrased my simple question differently the
outcome might have been different. The fact that she also knew I was a
weekend/hobby type pilot with no real career aspirations to be damaged
by a failed checkride might have also played a role. The additional
$150 might also have. I beat myself up pretty good for those two days
between tests, but the rewards of the 150 hours of flying (all in
C152/C150's) in the two years since have been so great that they far
outweigh any grief caused by that minor hiccup.

-R

Jon Kraus wrote:
Just curious as to how many of us are in the "Flunked a Checkride"
club.

Count me in too. I flunked my private checkride in 2002 on the first
try.

I and my instructor had no doubt that I was ready even with only about
40.5 total hours. The oral portion went splendidly, and I was having a
mostly fun and easy time with the flight portion also when I found
myself suddenly unable to make a 45-degree steep turn (in a Cessna 152)
without gaining 400 to 500 feet of altitude. I later figured that this
equates to about a 5000 F. P. M. climb. Those of you familiar with the
C152 know that a 5000 F. P. M. climb is not typically in the repertoir,
particularly with 45 degrees of bank. Did I mention that I took the
checkride in late June in Phoenix? I now know that I was in a big-time
thermal and mother nature was adding a bunch of external energy to my
carefully planned system. The amount of power reduction and nose-down
pitch that would have been required to stay within the P. T. S. would
have been very counter-intuituve in a steep turn and unlike anything I
had seen in a steep turn up to that point. The D. E. didn't really say
anything, we just went about completing the rest of the maneuvers. I
actually meant to come back to the steep turn later and make another
attempt, and I suspect the D. E. would have allowed me to do that, but
by the time we were ready to head back toward the airport and make some
landings my mind was on about a million other things and I forgot.

The D. E. didn't give me any indication as to my passing or failing as
we tied down the airplane but by then I had remembered that I never
sucessfully completed that steep turn. In fact, the D. E. called me a
prodigy during the de-briefing with my C. F. I. The exam was on a
Wednesday, and early on we had discussed the fact that the examiner
would be available on Friday if we had needed a continuance or a
re-test. In the de-brief, I made the mistake of asking the leading
question "So, do you want to see me on Friday?" instead of "So, did I
pass?" and I got the answer I was dreading. I logged about .6 hours
with my instructor on Thursday trying a few steep turns and about .6
with the examiner on Friday doing a single normal take-off, a steep
turn to the left, a steep turn to the right, and a normal landing, this
time at about 7:30 a.m. instead of 1 p.m. Pass.

In hindsight, I know the examiner knew I was safe enough to be worthy
of a licence to learn after the first test. I think she was looking
for a demonstration of confidence as well as a demonstration of
competence and that if I had phrased my simple question differently the
outcome might have been different. The fact that she also knew I was a
weekend/hobby type pilot with no real career aspirations to be damaged
by a failed checkride might have also played a role. The additional
$150 might also have. I beat myself up pretty good for those two days
between tests, but the rewards of the 150 hours of flying (all in
C152/C150's) in the two years since have been so great that they far
outweigh any grief caused by that minor hiccup.

-R

gatt wrote :
I failed my Private because I used a private field as a waypoint in my
cross-country plan.

Eh? There is no requirement for a waypoint, other than it had
better be something you can identify enroute. There has to be more to
this story.

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)

"Rob" wrote in message oups.com...

Jon Kraus wrote:
Just curious as to how many of us are in the "Flunked a Checkride"
club.

Count me in too. I flunked my private checkride in 2002 on the first
try.



Man, I've been trying and trying, but still can't seem to bust a checkride!

;-)

On Mon, 20 Dec 2004 20:16:43 GMT, Bob Moore
wrote:

"gatt" wrote

I failed my Private because I used a private field as a
waypoint in my cross-country plan.

WHATTT.... No way! You can use a tree as a waypoint as
long as it can be identified from the airplane in flight.
Maybe you failed because you could not identify the "grass"
field as a waypoint, not because it was a "private" field.

Bob Moore

My feelings exactly. I used private fields for my waypoints on
several cross countries WITH the CFI in the right seat. The only
point he made is that sometimes the private fields are hard to spot.

Corky Scott

"Bob Moore" wrote in message

I failed my Private because I used a private field as a
waypoint in my cross-country plan.

WHATTT.... No way! You can use a tree as a waypoint as
long as it can be identified from the airplane in flight.
Maybe you failed because you could not identify the "grass"
field as a waypoint, not because it was a "private" field.

Specifically, the DE knew the owner of the private field. There was an
airstrip that was UNMARKED across a little creek from a field. My
instructor and I incorrectly assumed that the paved strip was the private
airfield on the section. It turns out otherwise; the actual airstrip was
simply a field; when the farmer wanted to fly, he put up his windsock and
mowed himself a runway in the appropriate direction. Because I
misidentified the airport by thinking the strip across the street was
[whatever the private field was called], he busted me.

-c

wrote in message

Eh? There is no requirement for a waypoint, other than it had
better be something you can identify enroute. There has to be more to
this story.

Just related the whole details. In case you missed it, though; on the
abbreviated x-ctry I pointed out the window to an airstrip and said "there's
my waypoint." Turns out the airstrip indicated on the chart was across the
road. The DE knew the farmer, and knew that he just mowed a runway if he
wanted to fly. I don't know why the airstrip across the street wasn't
marked, but I was the first person to use it as a waypoint with that
particular examiner.

My CFI was less-than-pleased as well. The DE's point was, don't use
private airfields as waypoints.

-c

"gatt" wrote in message
...
[...] Because I
misidentified the airport by thinking the strip across the street was
[whatever the private field was called], he busted me.

Well, to be fair, that's different than you first described it. You failed
your checkride because you misidentified a waypoint. Not "because [you]
used a private field as a waypoint".

You just as easily could have misidentified a public airport, or you could
have passed your checkride had you correctly identified the private airport.
The choice of a waypoint you had difficulty identifying might have led to
the bust, but the mere choice of a private field didn't directly lead to
failing the checkride.

It's a good lesson though: waypoints should be easily identifiable. Two
similar airports right next to each other would not qualify. For sure, if
you ARE going to use an airport as a waypoint, you need to learn enough
about the airport to know whether you are looking at it or not when you
arrive. Including knowing whether it's paved or not.

Sounds like a fair bust to me. I'll bet you learned your lesson from that
though, and I'll bet there are some pilots who passed their checkride on the
first try who still need to learn that lesson.

Pete