Cirrus or Lancair?

Matt,

Cirrus is the first to receive certification that was "spin
resistant", but non-recoverable, hence the chute.


Not again. That statement is false, and you know it.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Xyzzy,

That impression may be driven by the fact that the only approved way to
recover from a spin in a Cirrus is to deply the parachute.


Not again. Please.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Not again. That statement is false and you know it.

You might want to talk to Cirrus and help them correct their manuals
then, because the Pilot Operating Handbook for the SR-22 says that the
only method of spin recovery is activating the CAPS (Cirrus Airframe
Parachute System). Here's an article from AOPA that talks about it:
http://www.aopa.org/asf/asfarticles/2003/sp0302.html

Here are some excerpts from the POH, quoted for your information:
"Spins
The SR22 is not approved for spins, and has not been tested or
certified for spin recovery characteristics. The only approved and
demonstrated method of spin recovery is activation of the Cirrus
Airframe Parachute System (See CAPS Deployment, this section).
Because of this, if the aircraft "departs controlled flight," the CAPS
must be deployed."

also

"Do not waste time and altitude trying to
recover from a spiral/spin before activating CAPS.
Inadvertent Spin Entry
1. CAPS ..................................................
................................Activate
Revision A1"

Ben Hallert
PP-ASEL

Ben,

does it say "non-recoverable", anywhere?

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

That impression may be driven by the fact that the only approved way to
recover from a spin in a Cirrus is to deply the parachute.

Not again. Please.

My apologies, when you said "Not again. Please." to a statement that
"the only approved way to recover from a spin in a Cirrus is to deploy
the parachute", I read that to mean that you disagreed with the
statement. If you meant something else, please clarify, as the POH
clearly indicates that the only approved way to recover from a spin in
the SR-22 is with the CAPS.

Ben Hallert
PP-ASEL

Ben,

I said "Not again, please" to this:

Cirrus is the first to receive certification that was "spin
resistant", but non-recoverable, hence the chute.

This statement says that the Cirrus is "non-recoverable" from a spin.
Which was never, ever proven, either way. Thus, the statement is false.
That process of proving it was exactly what Cirrus sought to eliminate
from certification with the chute. We just don't know how the Cirrus
reacts to "standard" spin-recovery techniques - and certainly we don't
"know" in the sense of scientific research required for certification.
Yet, Cirrus bashers just love to claim the Cirrus would not recover
from a spin when applying "standard" recovery techniques - which they
simply don't and can't know. The subject has been debated to death
here, hence my comment.


--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message
...
Ben,

I said "Not again, please" to this:

Cirrus is the first to receive certification that was "spin
resistant", but non-recoverable, hence the chute.

This statement says that the Cirrus is "non-recoverable" from a spin.
Which was never, ever proven, either way. Thus, the statement is false.
That process of proving it was exactly what Cirrus sought to eliminate
from certification with the chute. We just don't know how the Cirrus
reacts to "standard" spin-recovery techniques - and certainly we don't
"know" in the sense of scientific research required for certification.
Yet, Cirrus bashers just love to claim the Cirrus would not recover
from a spin when applying "standard" recovery techniques - which they
simply don't and can't know. The subject has been debated to death
here, hence my comment.


--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH


The ONLY "demonstrated and approved" method of spin recovery is activation
of the CAPS.

It says so in the POH.
http://www.cirrusdesign.com/servicec...InfoManual.pdf

Hi Thomas,

I'll help you with your memory. Please see your following post:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/...cab0e92eab8e64

Glad to be of service!

Regards,

Ben Hallert
PP-ASEL

On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 23:24:33 -0400, xyzzy wrote:

Matt Barrow wrote:

"xyzzy" wrote in message
...

Matt Barrow wrote:


"Sandstone" wrote in message
m...




So why is Cirrus selling three times as many (??) aircraft?

I'm sure whoever can answer that question definitively for Lancair can
make a lot of money.

Sirrus was first to the market place, they have had time to do a good
deal of advertizing, They have a large support/dealer program, and a
bit head start over Lancair. Myself, I prefer the Lancari to the
Sirrus, but then again, I'm building a Glasair III.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Gig,

The ONLY "demonstrated and approved" method of spin recovery is activation
of the CAPS.


Exactly what I'm saying.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)