Experience Question

In a previous article, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN" said:
Paul Tomblin wrote:
I took my wife and kids up for a short flight the day I passed my check
ride. I took my wife on an international flight at night to an airport
I'd never been two weeks later.


You're a brave man. I remember my first solo nighttime cross country flight: I

As a former orienteering competitor (came 4th in the North American
championships once), I have no problems with navigation with all this
electronic stuff backing up my map and compass skills.


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
Get with the program, jeffrey. No one is 'wrong' on Usenet. They are
either 100% totally correct, or they are 'a lying, scum sucking weasel.'
There is no in-between. -- Garrett Johnson

Paul Tomblin wrote:
You're a brave man. I remember my first solo nighttime cross country
flight: I

As a former orienteering competitor (came 4th in the North American
championships once), I have no problems with navigation with all this
electronic stuff backing up my map and compass skills.


So how are you at map reading on hazy dark moonless nights at altitude?



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

VE

Nurse Schnerd:

How is is that you were 35 miles from where you thought you were? Is your
airplane equipped with GPS, or other guidance? Aren't the VORs supposed
to give a hint?

About God's special dispensation for "morons," there does seem to be some
truth to this, given the most recent dozen or so crashes over the past few
days were by experienced pilots.

"Fred Choate" wrote in message
...
Hello All....

This may sound silly, but I would like to hear some opinions on a matter
presented to me this evening.

I recently got my ticket. I started 5 years ago, and due to certain
circumstances, I had to take 4 1/2 years off, then I picked up and did 10
more hours of training to prep for the checkride. My total hours to date
are 63.8 with 26.7 of those being solo time.

Okay, that being said, my In-Laws made a comment to me tonight about
flying with my children. Actually, they put it in the context of "do you
really think it is a good idea to fly with your children until you get
more hours....." followed by "....Larry (one of the In-Laws) didn't fly
with family members until he had 300 hours....".

I didn't even respond. My question to you folks is simply, how long did
you all wait before you decided it was safe to fly with your family?
Myself.....my kids were the first passengers I took up, and I felt
completely safe, prepared, and at ease with them in the aircraft with me.

Comments?

Fred



I would just tell them that you think it is safe or that you think that the
risk is reasonable.. There is little point in trying to back up your
position with facts, which really aren't on your side anyway. Reality is
that you are fairly inexperienced and you won't be able to overcome that
objection. However, inexperience doesn't mean high risk of a fatal
accident. If the flight is from one paved airport to another in VFR
weather, I doubt that there is much difference in risk between 63hrs and
1000hrs, you can either make the flight safely or you can't. You just
demonstrated on the checkride that you can make such flights in reasonable
safety.

When asked if flying with me is safe, I just answer "No, its not safe".

Mike
MU-2

"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message
ink.net...
[...]
When asked if flying with me is safe, I just answer "No, its not safe".

And in making that absolutely true statement, assuming by "I just answer"
you mean it stands alone, you're doing aviation a disservice.

The problem isn't so much that aviation is unsafe (it certainly can be
dangerous, and as the saying goes, is unforgiving of mistakes). It's that
people fail to recognize how many *other* things in their life are also
unsafe. Things that they are exposed to with much greater frequency than
most pilots are exposed to the risk of flying.

Acknowledging the hazards of aviation is well and good, but doing so without
putting those hazards into perspective just perpetuates the myth that flying
airplanes is only for daredevils.

Pete

"Fred Choate" wrote in message
...
Hello All....

This may sound silly, but I would like to hear some opinions on a matter
presented to me this evening.

I recently got my ticket. I started 5 years ago, and due to certain
circumstances, I had to take 4 1/2 years off, then I picked up and did 10
more hours of training to prep for the checkride. My total hours to date
are 63.8 with 26.7 of those being solo time.

Okay, that being said, my In-Laws made a comment to me tonight about
flying with my children. Actually, they put it in the context of "do you
really think it is a good idea to fly with your children until you get
more hours....." followed by "....Larry (one of the In-Laws) didn't fly
with family members until he had 300 hours....".

I didn't even respond. My question to you folks is simply, how long did
you all wait before you decided it was safe to fly with your family?
Myself.....my kids were the first passengers I took up, and I felt
completely safe, prepared, and at ease with them in the aircraft with me.

Comments?

Fred


I flew with a family member about 45 minutes after I had my SEL ticket. I
flew with a non-family meber about 15 after.

I flew with my son two hours after I got my R-H, and I'll fly with my son
about 30 seconds after the 40 hours is flown off my 601XL.

I love my son, I love my family and friends and I'm pretty damn fond of
myself. If I didn't think I would make it back safely to earth every time I
went up I wouldn't go up.

Gig 601XL Builder wr.giacona@coxDOTnet wrote:

I love my son, I love my family and friends and I'm pretty damn fond of
myself. If I didn't think I would make it back safely to earth every time I
went up I wouldn't go up.

You are not thinking any differently than every other pilot. If there were
a way to interview every pilot killed in an aircraft crash, everyone
(excluding those who set out to commit suicide) would most likely respond
in the manner in which you did. No one launches on their last flight
expecting anything other than to return home safely.

Recall the saying "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." All
pilots have good intentions, however, not all of these intentions transfer
into proper actions.

--
Peter
























----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

"Peter R." wrote in message
...
Gig 601XL Builder wr.giacona@coxDOTnet wrote:

I love my son, I love my family and friends and I'm pretty damn fond of
myself. If I didn't think I would make it back safely to earth every time
I
went up I wouldn't go up.

You are not thinking any differently than every other pilot. If there
were
a way to interview every pilot killed in an aircraft crash, everyone
(excluding those who set out to commit suicide) would most likely respond
in the manner in which you did. No one launches on their last flight
expecting anything other than to return home safely.

Recall the saying "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." All
pilots have good intentions, however, not all of these intentions transfer
into proper actions.

--
Peter


I understand what you are saying Peter, I don't think you understood what I
was saying.

I'm saying that if I didn't think it was safge enough for my family or
friends I wouldn't think it was safe enough for me.

Gig 601XL Builder wr.giacona@coxDOTnet wrote:

I understand what you are saying Peter, I don't think you understood what I
was saying.

I'm saying that if I didn't think it was safge enough for my family or
friends I wouldn't think it was safe enough for me.

Yes, I do understand what you are saying. My point is simply that every
pilot who was involved in a fatal accident (speaking of non-experimental GA
and excluding those who set out to commit suicide) most likely believed
what you and I believe.

The challenge we all continually face is putting our "money where our
mouths and keyhboards are." In other words, translate this belief into
actions (proper weather briefing, proper go/no-go/go-and-then-turn-
around-or-land decisions, proper fuel planning, practice or fly enough to
maintain proficiency, etc). Looking at GA accident statistics, this
clearly does not happen with enough regularity.


--
Peter
























----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

"Peter R." wrote in message
...
Gig 601XL Builder wr.giacona@coxDOTnet wrote:

I understand what you are saying Peter, I don't think you understood what
I
was saying.

I'm saying that if I didn't think it was safge enough for my family or
friends I wouldn't think it was safe enough for me.

Yes, I do understand what you are saying. My point is simply that every
pilot who was involved in a fatal accident (speaking of non-experimental
GA
and excluding those who set out to commit suicide) most likely believed
what you and I believe.

The challenge we all continually face is putting our "money where our
mouths and keyhboards are." In other words, translate this belief into
actions (proper weather briefing, proper go/no-go/go-and-then-turn-
around-or-land decisions, proper fuel planning, practice or fly enough to
maintain proficiency, etc). Looking at GA accident statistics, this
clearly does not happen with enough regularity.


Again I couldn't agree more but that wasn't what the OP was talking about.
He was asking a question related to piloting friends and family before he
has X hundred hours.