This should make most power pilots have kittens...

Hmm, sounds like a typical clueless motorhead.

Then again, if his only gliding experience is at a typical US
commercial operation, twirly-birding around in a 2-33, then it's
understandable!

Nothing a 500k out west in some nice glass wouldn't cure...

Kirk
Glasshole and motorhead, as required...

On 2005-11-16, G Farris wrote:
doesn't do it for me unless you're going somewhere. Gliders just fly and go
nowhere.

"Pilot" means 'navigator'. If you want to navigate you need power.

Ooooh! You've done it now! Especailly as you are so wrong you aren't
even wrong!

Gliders regularly make flights of hundreds of miles. Competitions are
regularly organized where gliders will fly tasks of hundreds of miles as
part of a competition. The last governor of the Isle of Man is an
accomplished glider pilot, and he did three diamond distances (500km)
in the UK which is quite an accomplishment with the British weather.

Most glider clubs will have pilots who fly a cross country flight every
time they are operating. Navigation is very challenging with gliders -
especially if you choose to do it without a GPS - because like sailing,
not only do you need to be able to figure a course from A to B, but you
must also be able to do that whilst seeking out sources of lift (meaning
your course is rarely a straight line). A bit like how a sailing boats
must tack when they want to go somewhere which isn't straight downwind.

Glider pilots must often be much more superior navigators than power
plane pilots, especially if they want to do navigation 'by hand'.

--
Dylan Smith, Port St Mary, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net

On 2005-11-16, G Farris wrote:
justified in feeling a great sense of accomplishment - I'm just saying
that for me, if I always had to land in the same place I took off I would
have given up aviation fairly early on.

You don't have to. Even though I'm an inexperienced glider pilot (only
about 50 hours in gliders), I've flown from one airport to another
airport in a glider. Any glider pilot who gets their basic 'Silver'
(that means virtually every glider pilot in Britain with any experience)
has flown from one place and landed at another in a glider.

--
Dylan Smith, Port St Mary, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net

Say what you will - I persist.
Gliders are great, certainly a lot of fun and skill, but transportation they
are not.

The OP suggested some nice glider footage would make motor pilots "have
kittens" from envy I suppose. I enjoyed the video, but had no kittens.

I did not mean to denigrate glider pilots' navigational skills (or any other
skills) and I'm sorry if anyone took it that way. "Navigate" to me, implies
going somewhere, which you have to admit is the exception and not the rule in
glider flying.

People fly for different reasons. If getting somewhere quickly, reliably and
safely is part of why you fly, then I'll bet powered flight is part of your
game.

GF

On 2005-11-16, G Farris wrote:
Say what you will - I persist.
Gliders are great, certainly a lot of fun and skill, but transportation they
are not.

The OP suggested some nice glider footage would make motor pilots "have
kittens" from envy I suppose. I enjoyed the video, but had no kittens.

That was me. No, the kittens were the "OMG that's so dangerous!" type.
Aerotow only clubs often think that people who take winch launches have
a few screws loose :-) Most power pilots blanch at the idea of being
pitched up 45 degrees nose up 200 feet off the deck on the end of a long
piece of string :-)

skills) and I'm sorry if anyone took it that way. "Navigate" to me, implies
going somewhere, which you have to admit is the exception and not the rule in
glider flying.

No, not really - most glider pilots (certainly glider pilots who own
their own glider) spend most of their time doing cross country flights.
True, gliders are not a method of practical transportation because you
are even more at the whim of the weather than a VFR only power pilot,
and you really need the support of others to do it (tow pilot or winch
driver/wing walkers etc.) but "going somewhere" is actually the rule
not the exception with most experienced glider pilots.

We don't fly cross country at Andreas mainly because on an island, there
isn't much cross country to fly! However, when we visit clubs in the UK,
virtually all the glider owners fly on cross countries when they come
out to fly.

--
Dylan Smith, Port St Mary, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
On 2005-11-16, G Farris wrote:
Say what you will - I persist.
Gliders are great, certainly a lot of fun and skill, but transportation
they
are not.

The OP suggested some nice glider footage would make motor pilots "have
kittens" from envy I suppose. I enjoyed the video, but had no kittens.

That was me. No, the kittens were the "OMG that's so dangerous!" type.
Aerotow only clubs often think that people who take winch launches have
a few screws loose :-) Most power pilots blanch at the idea of being
pitched up 45 degrees nose up 200 feet off the deck on the end of a long
piece of string :-)

skills) and I'm sorry if anyone took it that way. "Navigate" to me,
implies
going somewhere, which you have to admit is the exception and not the
rule in
glider flying.

No, not really - most glider pilots (certainly glider pilots who own
their own glider) spend most of their time doing cross country flights.
True, gliders are not a method of practical transportation because you
are even more at the whim of the weather than a VFR only power pilot,
and you really need the support of others to do it (tow pilot or winch
driver/wing walkers etc.) but "going somewhere" is actually the rule
not the exception with most experienced glider pilots.

We don't fly cross country at Andreas mainly because on an island, there
isn't much cross country to fly! However, when we visit clubs in the UK,
virtually all the glider owners fly on cross countries when they come
out to fly.


Dylan,
I agree with you. I began my flying career as a kid on gliders courtesy of
the RAF. We were winch launched either from adapted balloon winches or in
one case an old double decker bus where the drive shaft was connected to the
winch drum after the bus was positioned. That winch used piano wire and if
the tension on the wire ever loosened then there would be one almighty snarl
up which could take hours to sort out. Driving the winches in itself was a
considerable skill and I managed to get checked out on both winches piano
wire and stranded cable by the age of 16. That check out you had to be a
solo pilot, had the training in operating all aspects of the winch including
fixing cable breaks.

The feeling and rush you get as the take of run begins is still one of the
most exhilarating feeling ever. Accelerating from nothing to 50kts in a
couple of seconds is way cool and 35 years later I still enjoy it. Beats any
roller coaster.

As for gliding in general of course it is a sport but its a far more
challenging flying experience that thrashing a powered plane from A to BE.

For challenges in flying, its glider cross country's and instrument
approaches.

To be near God, then its soaring.

When flying really gets like driving a car then its mystery will be over as
it will be as dull as driving a car.

I drive because I have to, I fly because I want to, and I go gliding
because.... its too complex to explain.

"G Farris" wrote in message
...

"Pilot" means 'navigator'. If you want to navigate you need power.


I assume you leave the GPS in the car where it belongs?

:-)

--
Geoff
the sea hawk at wow way d0t com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
Spell checking is left as an excercise for the reader.

In article ,
TheSeaHawkatwowwayd0tcom says...


"G Farris" wrote in message
...

"Pilot" means 'navigator'. If you want to navigate you need power.


I assume you leave the GPS in the car where it belongs?

:-)

Of course! What would I want it for? My G-IVSP has full FMS.

:-)


GF

But that was so exceptional you still remember it 20 years on!;-)

I remember it because it set a new distance record, because I happened
to know the pilot, who lives near me, and because it was written up in
National Geographic. But since then, longer flights have become, if
not "commonplace," at least more common.

It's like the fact that most (older) people can remember the names of
at least most of the first seven astronauts, but few can remember any
of the many astronauts' names since then.

I never meant to suggest a glider is the ideal way to go from Portland
Maine to San Diego (although it might be the most fun, if you have the
time); I was just pointing out the error in your statement.

vince norris

On 2005-11-17, G Farris wrote:
Of course! What would I want it for? My G-IVSP has full FMS.

That's not flying, that's driving a fancy (and rather expensive) minivan
that happens to be able to get airborne :-)

--
Dylan Smith, Port St Mary, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net